Author Topic: MicRogue - Update Jun 19th  (Read 62114 times)

jasonpickering

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MicRogue - Update Jun 19th
« on: January 03, 2012, 05:05:31 AM »
Hey guys Need some feedback so here is Microgue!!


Basically I am at the point where I need to decide if this prototype is worth pursuing.

Now this build is an excellent vision of what the final game will be. It needs a lot of balance, which seems to be the main problem now, but all the combat is in. The player has two skills. these are built in for now but eventually the player will be able to choose which two they head into combat with.

Controls:
click next to the player to move around, get to the Alter on the 5th island (Game will end there but does not in the prototype just refresh and start over.
all skills cost 1 man and clicking the player opens your skill tab. let me know what you think.

no comment is two small. tell me everything.


eventually this will be an IOS game once I get sounds, music, and all that good stuff. also I will most likely add more content. new enemies/skills/locations. all that good stuff.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2012, 03:53:24 AM by jasonpickering »

Vanguard

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2012, 06:46:11 AM »
I like the core concept.

A larger playing field would allow more tactical options and interesting situations.  Even one more tile in each direction would help.  I don't know if you'd be able to fit that into the small resolution you have to work with, but it's worth considering.

The option to skip the player's turn would be nice.

The fire spell ought to kill goblins in one hit.  Right now it's rarely better than the heal spell, and making that change would bring the two a little closer together while also giving the player a better option against what is currently the most dangerous enemy.

It would be better if the player's initial move off of the bridge was automatic or "free" so it didn't consume the first turn, and that the spot in front of the bridge was always guaranteed not to have an enemy on it.  Right now the player technically has the first turn, but since there's only one move they can make, they can easily be placed in a situation where they take 3 damage before they're allowed to do anything to protect themselves.

Have you considered removing randomness from health and magic pickups?  In the game's current state, they're very important for success, but also they also seem unreliable.  Maybe getting a powerup for one in every five or so kills would be more fair?

Anyway, the game has potential and I hope it turns out well for you.

jasonpickering

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2012, 01:17:29 AM »
 I tried doing a bigger island. Right now its 6 by 4, but if I go any bigger it goes off the screen and not being able to see the entire island really changes gameplay.

yeah i should make the fire spell stronger

I agree with the bridge problem. the player can get stuck real bad.

I love the idea about the health/mana potions

A couple more questions. since the game's main focus is positioning yourself and the enemies, would skills that involve moving or manipulating the enemies be a better plan? A couple suggestions I had were giving the player some type of projectile allowing you to hit any enemy, this would be limited like the Mana. Another Idea was getting rid of Mana making the skills one time use for each island. so basically the player might have skills like throw rock, Skip Turn, Lunge (Attack Enemy and move into their space).

rachoac

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #3 on: January 07, 2012, 04:44:32 AM »
Hi there! I wish the arrow keys or WASD worked. At least for me on my browser, keyboard navigation didn't work.

AgingMinotaur

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2012, 12:29:14 AM »
Really cool, actually. I agree Vanguard's ideas make sense.

A problem as it stands, I think, is that it's a bit static. It feels now as if there are situations that become quite deterministic, where the player has little actual choice. Some ideas to consider that might add more strategy:

* Don't allow monsters to skip turn, even if they have no path to player? Make them dance around a bit if the player is hiding behind an impenetrable wall.
* Make healing cost one turn.
* Maybe have several exits from the rooms, and possibly allow monsters to move between them (in some/all cases)? Running away with a trail of monsters might prove deadly, but it would be satisfactory to find a yeti, or to use potions as walls to fend off one horde whilst taking on another.
* Allow (some/all) monsters to use potions? A monster stepping on a red potion could get 1 extra health, for instance. Also: Allow (some/all) monsters to destroy bone walls?
* More monsters of course, but maybe also more terrain types (eg. thorns make you lose one turn when you pass them, destructible obstacles already in place, traps, forest/shadow which make you "invisible" as long as move within them, making monsters stop or wander). In short: More effects to explot (and which the monsters might exploit).

Stray monster thoughts:
* Monsters that grant special movement (move diagonally for N turns, move in one-space jumps for N turns).
* Monster/potion that grants double speed for N turns.
* Monster that eats potions, destroy walls.
* Monster with (seemingly) adverse effect when killed. Killing a jelly makes you lose one turn (which can actually be what you want, sometimes). Multiplying jellies with this effect could prove interesting. Jelly farming would mean a whole new thing (and be extremely dangerous).
* Monster that, when killed, turns the next closest monster (or the next one you bump) into your ally (probably won't be able to leave map).
* "Boss" monsters, which may have special rewards (mana -> 5, raised health limit ...)?
* Giant monster (several tiles big)
* Monster that poisons the ground it has walked on? Other monsters will avoid (treat as wall), player can pass, but it costs 1 health.

Just some loose thoughts. Take what you can use, add salt and pepper. I really like the simplicity of the concept, and think you should stick to it. Adding too many features might take away some charm. But it's still an idea that is really spacious, you can get a really intersting bestiary without adding skill trees, submenus etc.

As always,
Minotauros
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.

jasonpickering

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2012, 05:35:28 AM »
AgingMinotaur: Those are some pretty good suggestions. Especially the stray Monster thoughts.

Okay, so it has occured to me that having a definite attack system. I.E. you always hit, and always do one damage. has made the game seem more like a puzzle. I did like this, but I just don't have the skills to build the Algorithm to make the levels work. So I added the posibility of Misses into the combat and it feels more like the mini dungeon crawl I started to make. I have added a Stat called Attack. It determines if you hit an enemy or not. You always do 1 damage though if a hit is successful. I wanted to keep stats to a minimum.

Try It

Right now the player has an attack value of 2. the higher that is the better chance you have of hitting an enemy. it makes the game feel very different, which I really dig. It makes it feel like the player has a fighting chance, and when I add something to help their stats (Health and Attack) they will feel like they have much more agency. Right now the numbers break down like this:

Miss Percentage.
Attack 1: %50
Attack 2: %33
Attack 3: %25
Attack 4: %21
Attack 5: %17
Attack 6: %15
Attack 7: %13

I take a random number from the attack number and if its 0 its a miss. So an attack of 3 is 0,1,2,3. so a 25% chance of pulling a zero. the only thing is I like the Curve this gives, but I would like it if it started a little lower. maybe even like at 80%. A monster with high HP, but a terrible attack rate would be Cool. Any Suggestions on ways to code this differently?

guest509

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2012, 12:23:34 PM »
  Hey you actually used that idea? Cool beans man!

  If you want to start the miss rate higher you can do what you are doing but then multiply by 1.5. So 50% miss becomes 75% miss.

You could also have the roll be 1-20 (or 1-12 or whatever) and hits only occur depending on rating. For example Attack rating 3 would hit on a 1-3 but 4-20 (or 4-12) is a miss. But this does not maintain the diminishing power curve.

  Or simply have the Attack rating be a straight %. Starting at 20% to hit and moving up by whatever amount seems appropriate. Lol for some reason games that move up by like 9% or some other odd number make me laugh. This would not keep the power curve though.

  I'm sure as you fiddle with it you'll settle upon something pretty neat.

EDIT: You could always say that 0 or 1 is a miss...so skill 2 ends up being 66% miss. But no monster could be skill 1, or they'd never hit!

AgingMinotaur

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2012, 02:48:58 PM »
I must say I preferred the deterministic combat system of the last version. It made me really calculate my strategies in the more interesting rooms. (Eg. "If I first go there and whack the yeti, I'll just have time to go down and kill the skeleton to get a wall, meaning the rat will come at me at the right moment for me to have initiative.") I think this could be elaborated, especially if the playing field gets more complex as the game progresses.

Not to say you can't have a good game with random combat. This is just comparing these two versions as they stand. For the record, I enjoy puzzles and board games ;)

As always,
Minotauros
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.

jasonpickering

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2012, 01:21:53 AM »
Big Update



So this has changed a lot since its was posted before and I decided to post a build.

Try it out

Right now I have a base tower all set up. I am using a combination of static design and random generation to make it easier for the player. Right now its 3 floors of fighting. the 4th floor will be a rest much like the town structure in Shiren the Wanderer. its then followed by 3 more floors of monsters and then the boss.

Also you can shoot a fireball, by clicking the fireball icon in the upper right, and then a direction.

I removed the randomized combat. the player has such little health that when you missed it had a huge effect in the player. I played a game called "You only lived once" and it had a lot of things I liked in the design. so please tell me what you think so far. I am open to any opinions.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2012, 01:23:36 AM by jasonpickering »

Pueo

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2012, 08:34:09 PM »
This is a great change!  I love the eyeballs and witches, they add another layer of strategy.  I love how you added the fireball back in.  Great work!
{O.o}
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AgingMinotaur

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2012, 10:55:05 PM »
Sweet!

As always,
Minotauros
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.

jasonpickering

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #11 on: February 14, 2012, 12:41:34 AM »
thanks guys. any suggestions at the moment or anything you would like to see? How far have you gotten into the game? were you able to beat the blob? I hope to make the bosses a little more exciting with special mechanics. I am open to any comments.

Hi

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #12 on: February 14, 2012, 03:24:03 AM »
I was confused by level nine because I got to the upstairs three times, just to be teleported back to the same place and then the blob would attack me.
Also because there is no stand still button but the creatures don't always move on there turn. I just jiggle around until they are at the right distance.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 03:27:26 AM by Hi »

jasonpickering

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2012, 06:03:55 AM »
Yeah the last level will actually be the boss monster.

I didn't add a skip turn since I think it's something we could start doing without. Do you think giving the monsters a chance to stand still effects in a negative way though.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2012, 06:05:44 AM by jasonpickering »

AgingMinotaur

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Re: MicRogue
« Reply #14 on: February 14, 2012, 06:11:06 PM »
I beat the blob, but not every time. Regarding monsters skipping a turn, I agree with Hi and probably think its best not to allow any actor (player or monster) to skip a turn.

It would be cool if there was more going on in level 4, something like a town, as you mention. Player could spend resources/xp/whatnot to improve magic, heal etc. Also, I'd guess some of the old monsters, like the skeleton, would still be interesting to put in the mix at this point?

As always,
Minotauros
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.