Temple of The Roguelike Forums
Websites => Temple of the Roguelike => Topic started by: getter77 on September 02, 2009, 02:30:21 AM
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I'm not at all lucid at the moment due to nothing good afoot, but still.
As suggested by Elig upon a proper thread derailment, let this topic be centered upon strategies by which to hopefully increase the amoung of people regularly checking and interacting within and about Roguetemple---providing the ideas actually work and/or are feasible. I'll keep updating the OP as new random things get thought up by folk already here and as things get accomplished. For starters:
-A Roguetemple Youtube channel to serve as an aggregate effort for video Let's Play's, walkthroughs, review, monthlyish news roundups, and whatever else concerning Roguelikes as a whole. Any various people that would cook up good stuff would then have the password and such to be able to post it all up in one organized place to build something of a brand in Roguetemple's comprehensiveness. Likewise some manner of streaming channel on the likes of http://www.livestream.com/ for matters of coordination of certain kinds of events, workshops, and thus undone team projects---just seems too handy to not take advantage of exploring.
-A MUCH stronger effort to reach out to/latch onto the various Retail Roguelikes as they happen and as they come along----especially the Japanese Mystery/Fushigi Dungeon franchise of games. There tend to be tens, if not hundreds of thousands of people that purchase these games the world over and enjoy then thoroughly...so getting Roguetemple into the stream of awareness as a place they could see discussions and/or content related to it that would hit word of mouth and Google searches would surely be a good thing. These games have a history of serving as a gateway to PC fare Roguelikes, providing people actually get pointed along in those directions lest they just stay in the Mysteries. In general, to not attempt to give a general good faith effort to raise up retail projects is self-destructive and smacks of utter foolishness in terms of undercutting further advances with the scope of Roguelikes. Possibly look into setting up an affiliate system in regards to any online retailers that carry Roguelikes----something along the lines of how RPGCodex has the like with GoG.com.
-Try to grab more interviews with Roguelike developers and other people relative to the Roguelike process and related tangents. These anecdotes and illuminatory pieces are in tremendous need of 1. Existing 2. Being archived good and proper for future reference years down the line. John Harris is only one man afterall.
-Screenshots of all games possible, ideally in a variety of situations within each respective game. Even the ASCII folk have need of seeing the letters and symbols.
-Contests along similar, yet perhaps more comprehensive themes, in line with the 7DRL, Crawl, and Nethack affairs that happen here and there with each year.
-Localized and Personalized resources onsite in regards to helping people write Roguelikes of their own...lots of them. The mystery needs to be in the play experience, not the makeup of bars to entry---walls to be knocked down to hurdles and steps.
-As mentioned before, for as many new and ongoing Roguelikes as possible to include good old www.roguetemple.com somewhere within their splash screen or shortly thereafter so as to inform the myriad, currently nameless and faceless players the world over of the site's existence and hopefully allow them to connect the dots and venture to this place. In turn, of course, Roguetemple must be a fit residence/stopover for said title.
-Webchats or some other thing where there can be a general meeting time and place to pop into without having to mess with IRC and have a realtime conversation with other people regarding Roguelikes in general. Possibly try to attract noticeable guests to attend for some such times.
-If anybody happens to be a Goon, to keep them fully abreast of the latest releases and developments for their various megathreads, especially one biggie they have for Roguelikes in general that seems to have a tendency to generate mega-threads for specific games. In some ways I can easily see how they'd have a much more robust discussion environ than here at Roguetemple and the Google Groups, but in other ways I feel that's just damn insane considering said kind of discussion is pretty well the central core of the latter.
-Profuse crosslinking and crosspromotion onsite with all manner of Roguelikes from the ever popular to the ones languishing in the darker part of the shadows.
-Providing it pans out the way it is being framed in the coming months, investigate the new aspect for Stardock's Impulse Reactor Phase IV which, among other aspects, seems to have doors open for hobbyist game free dispersal and perhaps sale...seemingly to a more flexible degree than Valve's Steam. Likewise, there should probably be an effort to get at least some of the older, "done" Roguelikes up on GoG.com's free game section. I doubt they've people beating their doors down at this point to get up there---thus I would reckon better odds of a more favorable response and likewise more visibility for the world of Roguelikes in general as many of the lapsed customers on there may very likely be well out of the loop.
Well, there's the top of my head roughly. There must be more and/or better yet still...
Such as:
-Analysis and cataloging of the various topics of implementation relative to Roguelikes, ie Religions, ID games, etc.
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That kind of advertising and promoting can backfire. I think roguelike games don't need advertising. People that are interested about them will find them.
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I suggest an interview with Krice, including scantly clad money shots.
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One of the problems for roguetemple is it's audience is focused on roguelike development and not playing. Well that's not a problem per say, but that audience is smaller.
Most of the players are interested in the one specific game they play and most games have their own independent side area, something that is necessary.
I don't really have a solution in mind, but it's not a bad thing to attract developers. Trying to get more of the developers from other games to post here would be a good start though, so I second the interviews.
Also, maybe directing some more topics on implementing features beyond the fov, map generation discussions, and basic AI that tends to dominate roguelike discussion despite the fact all of those are relatively easy to do and take a small fraction of the time necessary to develop a game.
Stuff like power curves, or player choices, skill system vs leveling, religion, and other stuff like that would make the development discussions more interesting.
Well, that's what I am interested in at least.
How about, The Roguelike Item Game Megathread! Or, The Roguelike Religion Megathread!
Now that would be very cool stuff. I'd love to hear what developers were thinking when they put in their identification games, or how religion is implemented in various roguelikes. Status effects could be cool too, every major roguelike seems to implement confusion, fear, and poison nowadays. Let's see a poll bands vs. hacks and discuss the differences and what that means for game play.
I'd love to talk to other developers about their ideas. I find that stuff very interesting and picking their brains would help keep me motivated.
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I'm not at all lucid at the moment due to nothing good afoot, but still.
Awesome :)
As suggested by Elig upon a proper thread derailment, let this topic be centered upon strategies by which to hopefully increase the amoung of people regularly checking and interacting within and about Roguetemple---providing the ideas actually work and/or are feasible. I'll keep updating the OP as new random things get thought up by folk already here and as things get accomplished. For starters:
-A Roguetemple Youtube channel to serve as an aggregate effort for video Let's Play's, walkthroughs, review, monthlyish news roundups, and whatever else concerning Roguelikes as a whole. Any various people that would cook up good stuff would then have the password and such to be able to post it all up in one organized place to build something of a brand in Roguetemple's comprehensiveness. Likewise some manner of streaming channel on the likes of http://www.livestream.com/ for matters of coordination of certain kinds of events, workshops, and thus undone team projects---just seems too handy to not take advantage of exploring.
Excellent idea. I definitely think this should be done. A central youtube channel for the roguelike community is definitely needed.
-A MUCH stronger effort to reach out to/latch onto the various Retail Roguelikes as they happen and as they come along----especially the Japanese Mystery/Fushigi Dungeon franchise of games. There tend to be tens, if not hundreds of thousands of people that purchase these games the world over and enjoy then thoroughly...so getting Roguetemple into the stream of awareness as a place they could see discussions and/or content related to it that would hit word of mouth and Google searches would surely be a good thing. These games have a history of serving as a gateway to PC fare Roguelikes, providing people actually get pointed along in those directions lest they just stay in the Mysteries. In general, to not attempt to give a general good faith effort to raise up retail projects is self-destructive and smacks of utter foolishness in terms of undercutting further advances with the scope of Roguelikes. Possibly look into setting up an affiliate system in regards to any online retailers that carry Roguelikes----something along the lines of how RPGCodex has the like with GoG.com.
Along these lines, it'd be nice if we did a better job in reaching out to the larger roguelike community in general. It'd be nice to get a link to here on Nethack's website, for instance. Or at least a link to Roguebasin which links here. Although it'd be more difficult, if we could get a link actually inside some roguelikes (Even 7DRLs) that would be awesome. We should also try to get links on DoomRL, angband.oook.cz and any other major sites.
-Try to grab more interviews with Roguelike developers and other people relative to the Roguelike process and related tangents. These anecdotes and illuminatory pieces are in tremendous need of 1. Existing 2. Being archived good and proper for future reference years down the line. John Harris is only one man afterall.
This is an excellent idea. Interviews can be as simple as 10 questions over e-mail. We should really be doing more of these, and trying to get links to Rogue Temple from said developers. :)
-Screenshots of all games possible, ideally in a variety of situations within each respective game. Even the ASCII folk have need of seeing the letters and symbols.
It would be nice to have user uploaded photos like a content management system for this and other uses.
-Contests along similar, yet perhaps more comprehensive themes, in line with the 7DRL, Crawl, and Nethack affairs that happen here and there with each year.
In the MZX community, the main competition happens twice a year. Perhaps a bi-annual 7DRL would be good? I'm not sure if it makes things better or worse to run it twice a year. Certainly, we should have more competitions of some kind.
-Localized and Personalized resources onsite in regards to helping people write Roguelikes of their own...lots of them. The mystery needs to be in the play experience, not the makeup of bars to entry---walls to be knocked down to hurdles and steps.
More tutorials and such are always good :)
-As mentioned before, for as many new and ongoing Roguelikes as possible to include good old www.roguetemple.com somewhere within their splash screen or shortly thereafter so as to inform the myriad, currently nameless and faceless players the world over of the site's existence and hopefully allow them to connect the dots and venture to this place. In turn, of course, Roguetemple must be a fit residence/stopover for said title.
-Webchats or some other thing where there can be a general meeting time and place to pop into without having to mess with IRC and have a realtime conversation with other people regarding Roguelikes in general. Possibly try to attract noticeable guests to attend for some such times.
There are good webchat clients these days, we just need to make sure we get one thats good. A Java IRC client that uses a webstart is one idea. Any webchat we have should probably connect automatically to #rgrd. Anyway, I think this would be a great addition.
-If anybody happens to be a Goon, to keep them fully abreast of the latest releases and developments for their various megathreads, especially one biggie they have for Roguelikes in general that seems to have a tendency to generate mega-threads for specific games. In some ways I can easily see how they'd have a much more robust discussion environ than here at Roguetemple and the Google Groups, but in other ways I feel that's just damn insane considering said kind of discussion is pretty well the central core of the latter.
-Profuse crosslinking and crosspromotion onsite with all manner of Roguelikes from the ever popular to the ones languishing in the darker part of the shadows.
Agreed!
-Providing it pans out the way it is being framed in the coming months, investigate the new aspect for Stardock's Impulse Reactor Phase IV which, among other aspects, seems to have doors open for hobbyist game free dispersal and perhaps sale...seemingly to a more flexible degree than Valve's Steam. Likewise, there should probably be an effort to get at least some of the older, "done" Roguelikes up on GoG.com's free game section. I doubt they've people beating their doors down at this point to get up there---thus I would reckon better odds of a more favorable response and likewise more visibility for the world of Roguelikes in general as many of the lapsed customers on there may very likely be well out of the loop.
Well, there's the top of my head roughly. There must be more and/or better yet still...
I think this is a pretty good amount of work to start on.
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That kind of advertising and promoting can backfire. I think roguelike games don't need advertising. People that are interested about them will find them.
The issue as I see it is one of stagnation risks and things falling through the cracks. I pick up on an undercurrent of the "Old Guard" reckoning that all will work out with no effort because it came up around them by chance and little to no thought given to History and carrying onward as the years go on to where there won't be any people left within even vague recollections of the heydays. Otherwise, by my reckoning, there have only been a few scattered new posters in absolute terms since I happened to luck out and find this place---let alone most of the registered folk's would seem to be very much inactive. All in all, such matters don't add up on consideration of the significance of Roguelikes in general within the grand scheme of videogames, let alone the RPG niche.
Besides, come on Krice, if things were REALLY set to be self-perpetuating/sustaining in regards to the lot of this, the outstanding majority of the posts and topics I've made and raised on here and elsewhere would've happened all on their own well before the presence of me, a 3rd party interloper newcomer, having to raise a ruckus on anything and everything at times. Not to mention we would've have not as likely already lost at least one or two substantial Roguelikes long before the likes of this place existed---tragic as that all is in terms of waste and the historical implications. Thus, a need to be proactive in the present/future to prevent the horrible, if unintentional at the time and given the times, mistakes of the past as best as possible.
Or even just the fact that if people don't see information before them to process and take in readily to form interests, odds are they won't spontaneously figure it out through a mad process of independent discovery and/or hallucination.
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I'm not at all lucid at the moment due to nothing good afoot, but still.
Awesome :)
How are the rough/bad times in my personal life awesome? :'( ;)
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No offense, but sometimes it's hard to understand exactly what you mean. I think that just happened to him! I'm pretty sure he misunderstood you! Either way, here's hoping for the best. Most of the ideas sound great!
Of course, me being too busy... ::) ;) ;D
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No offense, but sometimes it's hard to understand exactly what you mean. I think that just happened to him! I'm pretty sure he misunderstood you! Either way, here's hoping for the best. Most of the ideas sound great!
Of course, me being too busy... ::) ;) ;D
Bah, largely fixed. Sorry about the incoherency at times....it tends to happen often due to whatever choice of words not quite hitting the mark.
Even as a busy fellow, ye can always throw ideas out! :D Besides, in theory, as/if some of these notions get streamlined with the kinks worked out, some bits wouldn't wind up taking more than a couple minutes to wrangle and post/upload as the case might be.
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I'm not at all lucid at the moment due to nothing good afoot, but still.
Awesome :)
How are the rough/bad times in my personal life awesome? :'( ;)
I thought you meant you were drunk :) Anyway, no one is hurt from discussing ideas for the improvement of the Rogue Temple, so discuss! :D
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Besides, come on Krice, if things were REALLY set to be self-perpetuating/sustaining in regards to the lot of this
They usually are. People who like to play roguelike games are not looking for words, they are looking for new games that are at least equal to old classics like Nethack. If we developers can't make such games then no words can save the day.
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Besides, come on Krice, if things were REALLY set to be self-perpetuating/sustaining in regards to the lot of this
They usually are. People who like to play roguelike games are not looking for words, they are looking for new games that are at least equal to old classics like Nethack. If we developers can't make such games then no words can save the day.
Elig: Oddly enough, I'm too lazy to drink. No idea how that works...
Developers are but one (important) aspect to all this. There's something to be said for the other people involved helping to boost something past a highly sequestered environ. The works of history's great artists and musicians would NEVER be where they were at right now if not for their fans AND patrons putting forth many efforts of their own to wrangle for more and more people to hear and view the works, and in turn showcase it to yet more people...you get the idea.
There's also issues of taste. Nethack may not be the magic ticket for an untold number of people...could be Mageguild....or Nazghul, there's really no telling. Frankly, it is hard to draw very many conclusions at all in the grand scheme of Roguelikes since there has been such a relatively small population sample to work with over the years to establish even varying trends based on the people at the time. Even though it has Tiles, I'M not really even drawn to Nethack.
Not to mention, playing other games enhances developers by allowing them to confront differing ideas to their existing ones and broaden their horizons. Roguelike devs miss games too, sometimes lots of them, so it is to the overall benefit of the Development pool for everybody to have as wide a body to draw experiences from as possible.
I reckon Roguetemple as the logical place to exist with something to offer on most all fronts considering the state of Roguelikes in absolute terms and in relation to other videogames. Like anything though, it'll take some various doings.
You would be a good interview target regarding Kaduria and such down the line once all is situated an a good, comprehensive rubric is hashed out..
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One of the problems for roguetemple is it's audience is focused on roguelike development and not playing. Well that's not a problem per say, but that audience is smaller.
From rgr* and Roguetemple it appears that people who play roguelikes are also usually interested in roguelike development (and are skilled in it or willing to learn). Although other roguelike forums (centered at specific games) do not give that impression.
I see the following uses for a general roguelike forum: 1) discuss what good ideas have been implemented in which roguelikes, and what good ideas have not been implemented yet, and how to combine these ideas into new games -- people interested in such discussions are likely to be developers and we have them. 2) announcements of new games and other roguelike-related things -- we have that too. 3) suggest the roguelike players which roguelikes in existence they should try out -- I think that's what you say is missing, but specific roguelike forums are also good for that...
Also, maybe directing some more topics on implementing features beyond the fov, map generation discussions, and basic AI that tends to dominate roguelike discussion despite the fact all of those are relatively easy to do and take a small fraction of the time necessary to develop a game.
Yeah, I noticed it long ago (at rgrd). Lots of posts regarding basic stuff, and not many regarding e.g. balance, which is IMO a real problem in roguelike development.
Status effects could be cool too, every major roguelike seems to implement confusion, fear, and poison nowadays.
You mean a thread listing all states existing in roguelike, and ideas for new original states? That could be fun :)
Otherwise, by my reckoning, there have only been a few scattered new posters in absolute terms since I happened to luck out and find this place---let alone most of the registered folk's would seem to be very much inactive.
For me Roguetemple appears in Google search for "roguelike" just after Wikipedia definition, Roguebasin, DCSS, and image results. So this is quite good placement (although Wikipedia's definition is worse than Roguebasin, and DCSS might be placed lower). I have not looked at sites of big roguelikes that much, but I think they usually state their Roguelike roots, and guys interested in trying other similar games and discussing them should find Roguetemple... at least it seems so.
Maybe the big games should try giving Roguetemple as an alternative to discussion at rgr*. I think most people nowadays feel much more comfortable with web-based forums than with rgr*, and yet e.g. DCSS lists only newsgroups and mailing lists as possible discussion sites. (Is there any DCSS developer on Roguetemple? Maybe we should get one, and let our DCSS section grow)
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Honestly, the RGR groups, dev in particular, drive me insane at their lack of moderation leading to the mass spam of junk ads that tend to bury any actual talks. It doesn't even need to be as rigid as *Announce has it...just give various logical people the power to click an "x" or something to delete/ban the spammers after the fact. That kind of problem simply doesn't exist around here.
Somethingawful, by my reckoning, has the most ongoing discussions period in general terms of Roguelikes, whereas Dwarf Fortress does most of it on itself onsite. Somethingawful also costs money to post on....so again it seems so very odd that a free place with a good setup like around here falls far behind in some areas like that. Though it is older and more well known to be fair. In that regard I see it as beneficial to boost the notoriety of Roguetemple as proactive since we've not the luxury of age to beget it. As more things are wrangled here, visibly with clamour, that should at least get people posting here as well as places like SA or gamefaqs for a start---then ultimately get new people and just keep going as the ideas flow and as what works is discerned.
There's things in the short term to experiment with same as with the long term since this is a general place not dedicated in large part to any one game. Obviously Slash will have to weigh in on the lot of it, especially the likes of a youtube channel bearing the name.
I can't see how there's not good progress to be made though once some general checklists get nailed down. If anything, since Roguelikes are so behind the times in lots of respects versus the other big genres, it should be possible to make some great leaps in cultivation moving forward.
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Honestly, the RGR groups, dev in particular, drive me insane at their lack of moderation leading to the mass spam of junk ads that tend to bury any actual talks.
Don't use google groups. Get usenet from a real provider and you won't get any spam.
-Ido.
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Yeah. From my provider I get only like 10% of rgrd threads to be spam threads, and they are mostly quite obvious spam, and nobody responds to them, so they can be easily ignored.
But still, the point is that Usenet is hard to get into. Maybe we could get Crawlers to discuss at Roguetemple? They have only Usenet now. Not sure about Angband and Nethack fans.
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My ISP does not even carry ANY usenet. they dropped usenet years ago and I'm not paying for a usenet feed (all I read is rgrd anyway).. I'll stick to here and jettison rgrd.
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As a player, I would like to see this site become a hub for all(most all) roguelike players. I actually visit this site most every day or few days to see what the latest posts are. No matter what they are.
As for suggestions, I'm not sure. It's midnight right now and I finding it even hard to type correctly. Maybe create boards here for each major roguelike and try to drive player traffic to them boards. This won't work in all cases (angband, dwarf fortress), but maybe some others. Maybe I'll scout the net and see what I can come up with.
I don't know how many people play roguelikes but it seems that we are few and far between. A strong community would keep these games going for years to come. I don't think I should worry to much, but it feels as if this genre is dying out.
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I think it's really the question if the need and desire for discussions is mainly, as mentioned above, a developer's and supporter's issue, or a player's wish. I can imagine that pointing to roguetemple in our games, as mentioned above, might lead some people here, but only those who care so much about a roguelike they're playing that they ask questions or give feedback. I noticed that many of them mainly play a game and are either happy with it or abandon it after trying out, and those who want to discuss games such as DCSS or Powder find their way even to usenet.
And additionally, perhaps some roguelike players are not even aware that they're playing roguelikes, but just have fun with a nice (a) freeware game or (b) console-style RPG (in case of Shiren series, for example). Don't know if making them aware is necessary.
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In my mind, that's where appealing on multiple fronts comes to bear. I've seen games with essentially a dead board on gameFAQ's serving as the closest thing to a proper discussion of it UNTIL somebody/various people started concocting Let's Plays on youtube for them. Suddenly, people have things to discuss about the game based on the video, people that totally missed out on the the first time around are asking what it is and where to get it, and all is for the better on it. There is a fair chance that no matter what is done, some players will simply enjoy the game and not mess with any discussions, which is fine, but I can't shake the feeling that there are a good many people that wouldn't fall into that category considering the tremendous amount of players that wind up actively discussing various games in other genres.
As to audience, again the Mystery Dungeon series of graphical Roguelikes tends to sell many thousands worldwide, some in the million+ range. From a broader point, the Diablo styled games are also pretty key sellers with many Roguelike elements at their core...so there are surely potential fans in there. As a given, there's POWDER, ADOM, Nethack, and Crawl folk and the mysterious smattering of PC roguelike players in general. Roguelikes have tended to be more esoteric in terms of presence and such versus racing games, platformers, etc---which has worked to an extent, but I reckon now is as good a time as ever to get some spotlights going.
Of course, the other trick to grow an audience is with games that reach around to other genres---Spelunky being an excellent recent example.
For a random example relative to Karzack's: Roguetemple could join in/contribute to clamour for the upcoming hopeful release of the big Incursion rewrite currently due out at the end of October as they've just a google group and a megathread on Bay12 and Something Awful to my recollection.
Edit: Scrub that last bit as more of a long term eventuality...looks like the Incusion page was update a little while back leaning things moreso towards an October 31st 2010 release versus this year---though he is about half done with the sprawling changes and improvements.
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I think it's really the question if the need and desire for discussions is mainly, as mentioned above, a developer's and supporter's issue, or a player's wish.
I like the emphasis on developer discussion, but as has been said most developers are players, and a healthy community has all sorts. I think TIGS is a good example.
Also I second the idea that not all players are looking for a Nethack, or ADOM, or Crawl. I like to play the smaller and less classic games a lot of the time.
As far as promotion, I don't think you necessarily need to 'promote' a site, as much as do things (which add value to the site) that inherently promote the site. A group youtube/flickr stream/liveplay etc. is a great idea.
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http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=907
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=908
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=909
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=910
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=911
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=912
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=913
Have been created.
Regarding issue 912 "Add Development Resources": I think this is mostly covered by roguebasin, we could look forward to some kind of integration (similar to the roguelike DB)
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I don't know how many people play roguelikes but it seems that we are few and far between. A strong community would keep these games going for years to come. I don't think I should worry to much, but it feels as if this genre is dying out.
Haha, roguelikes have been dying out for 25 years. And amazingly people are still playing them and developing them. Every first year cs student wants to program the next nethack. Sure, you will be hard pressed to go to a party and find anyone else in the room that plays rls, but the player group is getting bigger and there are more projects around now than ever.
Roguelike players are just very quiet. Yes we need to make the genre more cool...
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http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=907
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=908
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=909
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=910
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=911
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=912
http://slashie.net/mantis/view.php?id=913
Have been created.
Regarding issue 912 "Add Development Resources": I think this is mostly covered by roguebasin, we could look forward to some kind of integration (similar to the roguelike DB)
Wow, thanks Slash...here I was wondering what you'd think of any of it period! :D
I am definitely going to have to spend time with this Mantis thing...
Keep the notions coming folk, perhaps chasing after coremn's "Cool"...?
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Getter, you are welcome to setup the youtube channel. Let us know about it :)
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I'll surely try to look into it in the coming days/weeks. While the name is obvious enough I DO need to think of a nice password for everybody to use...
Congrats on part 1 of the Biskup interview!
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THank you,
Also, everybody, remember I am open to all interviews, reviews, previews, views, subviews, anything you think is worthy, as long as it is well written and relevant. Just ping me if you have something worth for the rogueworld to see ;)
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THank you,
Also, everybody, remember I am open to all interviews, reviews, previews, views, subviews, anything you think is worthy, as long as it is well written and relevant. Just ping me if you have something worth for the rogueworld to see ;)
I'd actually love to interview you, I just need to come up with good questions. I'm even an English major in college, and worked for the student newspaper interviewing people. Would it be alright if I e-mailed you once I came up with some good questions?
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Nethack Dev Team interview: when to expect new version of NH?
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Nethack Dev Team interview: when to expect new version of NH?
Actually, I'd bet that the nethack dev team would be open to an interview, probably provided that we don't ask when a new version will be released ;)
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I'd actually love to interview you, I just need to come up with good questions. I'm even an English major in college, and worked for the student newspaper interviewing people. Would it be alright if I e-mailed you once I came up with some good questions?
Yeah, that'd be alright.
Actually, I'd bet that the nethack dev team would be open to an interview, probably provided that we don't ask when a new version will be released
I've always thought the nethack dev team was an abstract entity
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I've always thought the nethack dev team was an abstract entity
It's about time to find out what it is.
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It's the slow pace of the roguelike scene. There's barely anything to read about and it's not rare to come back after 2 months to find nothing new has happened (in some cases, this translates into years). I'm not sure there really is anything that can be done about that, that's just the way roguelikes roll. There is a limited amount of interviews and reviews to be written and read and discussing strategies usually gets old fast.
The few roguelikes that garner active participation have their own forums as well (ironically, Dwarf Fortress is the only active one I can think off - and that's technically not even a roguelike).
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I just kinda doubt it. I mean, just look at the mass amount of different things making good progress these past 2 months on the Roguebasin announce dealie. Plenty lack any discussions, or even any real spoilers out there, so there's a bit of pioneering that can be had. Just a matter of coming up with things, time doing stuff, and people popping by and contributing any number of nifty ways. Optimism! 8)
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I just kinda doubt it. I mean, just look at the mass amount of different things making good progress these past 2 months on the Roguebasin announce dealie. Plenty lack any discussions, or even any real spoilers out there, so there's a bit of pioneering that can be had. Just a matter of coming up with things, time doing stuff, and people popping by and contributing any number of nifty ways. Optimism! 8)
I agree! I feel quite guilty myself for not contributing more recently, except that I'm so busy :(
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I just kinda doubt it. I mean, just look at the mass amount of different things making good progress these past 2 months on the Roguebasin announce dealie. Plenty lack any discussions, or even any real spoilers out there, so there's a bit of pioneering that can be had. Just a matter of coming up with things, time doing stuff, and people popping by and contributing any number of nifty ways. Optimism! 8)
I agree! I feel quite guilty myself for not contributing more recently, except that I'm so busy :(
Don't be! We've all our various wranglings afoot...there's an ebb and flow to these things. Your banging away on your Roguelike serves the lot of it quite handily. ;D
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-Another thing to consider: Specifically reaching out to existing P&P and Tabletop entities so as to serve up games within their respective scopes. While Incursion manages to skirt along the D&D OGL stuff rather deftly, it would also probably be nice for people to not have to in regards for other systems. There's a great many systems out there that, I reckon, would very much benefit from a videogame/Roguelike incarnation. Odds are whatever legal wranglings would likely proclude the likes of some of the bigger and more notorious fish, like The Dark Eye and Shadowrun, at least at the onset, but should a track record of fun and well implemented games be established along other lesser known, but still quality, "games" that would surely bode well. There's much in common among Roguelikes and this sort of thing as well.
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-Another thing to consider: Specifically reaching out to existing P&P and Tabletop entities so as to serve up games within their respective scopes. While Incursion manages to skirt along the D&D OGL stuff rather deftly, it would also probably be nice for people to not have to in regards for other systems. There's a great many systems out there that, I reckon, would very much benefit from a videogame/Roguelike incarnation. Odds are whatever legal wranglings would likely proclude the likes of some of the bigger and more notorious fish, like The Dark Eye and Shadowrun, at least at the onset, but should a track record of fun and well implemented games be established along other lesser known, but still quality, "games" that would surely bode well. There's much in common among Roguelikes and this sort of thing as well.
I think this is an excellent idea. Around here, there are a lot of comic book stores that have "game night" where a bunch of tabletop RPG and cardgame players come in and game. These people would probably be more interested in roguelikes than any other, so it would make sense to market to them. There are probably large D&D based message boards somewhere, we might be able to interest some of them in roguelikes..
Another idea would be basing roguelikes on traditional tabletop RPGs more heavily, as a way of marketing to the tabletop RPG market. D20RL?
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It just strikes me as something that "should" have happened years ago, like so many of the other things I've mentioned in here, considering the confluence of interests, mechanics involved, and honesly many P&P things boil down to being Roguelikes that use paper, people, and physical props in lieu of any actual programming and such along standard videogame lines. Largely, if people wanted to come up with games that are fun while not having skills/capabilities/drives to learn their way around prgramming/art/sound---P&P is where they've been turning to. Which is very logical since D&D itself manifested from some older primordial ooze of strategy war gaming as per my gisty understanding of it.
Main thing that sparked me on this was discovering 2 very decent LP's on youtube, one completed in part and the other well in progress, by 2 delightful German players running the gauntlet and commenting on the first 2 games in the Realms of Arcania series in English. By that I mean, I've spent the last few days of traitorous-mouse-time watching through them and thereby studying the games/this older incarnation of the Dark Eye system and how they implemented it for about 10ish hours a day...
Though to be fair, Incursion and Sewer Jacks DID cause the first bubbles in my head months ago as they came up and to be.
On the Roguelike front, I've seen various people in various places that seemingly have technical talents getting utterly bogged down on the actual ruleset/game world/content part and result in nothing coming of it. So with the P&P/tabletop fare already handling the heavy lifting on that front combined with an existing fanbase of sorts it would bode well. There are some general online play P&P outlets out there...think the Blood Bowl one is called FUMBL or some such...but nothing on the level of really breathing life into the schematics as a full fledged videogame experience. ( I mean outside of Blood Bowl and the knockoff'ish game before it, the recent and upcoming Drakensang games, you get the idea. Those are far and away the exceptions rather than the rules out of the vast myriad of English language P&P and Tabletop stuff alone and even then very "compromised" versus say how deep and varied Incursion will be representing D&D should all things continue rolling on along)
Like most of the stuff in here, food for thought until the time comes down to tracking down people, organizing, and rolling the dice on the lot of it. Roguelikes pretty much invented "kitchen sink'ing" it in terms of inclusion in/breadth of games so this strikes me as far too plentiful a bounty to ultimately leave on the table unawares.
There's also an anime store in my area that has taken to miniatures, TCG's, and the like for regular events as ye mention Elig. Comic shop too though I've no idea what they have going on per se. I suppose it should round out somewhere in my todo list to try and find myself up there to pump for more information and the like and buy a pack of gum or something so as to make it worth their while in any case. Might not be a bad idea for your's either should the notion and oppourtunity happen to avail itself to you sometime here on ahead.
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I've posted a message with a link and Roguetemple banner in my forum.
http://www.funkelwerk.de/forum/index.php?topic=182.msg443#msg443
Maybe it will help some people to find this place :)
Edit: Now using the forum header instead of the banner, that looks better there ...
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Cool! Thanks Hajo. 8)
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Hey, I think my old Dwarf-Fortress friends don't know about this place. I should add a link to this place in their "Roguelike Development Megathread". They would liven up Rogue Temple some.
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Probably a good idea Fenrir, more the merrier as Other Games is fairly active. ;)
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Fenrir stares at getter77 in surprise.
You... You're from Bay12?
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Fenrir stares at getter77 in surprise.
You... You're from Bay12?
I tend to manifest various places. Though in my case, as somebody watching from afar on Dwarf Fortress thus far, Other Games is pretty much the only place that makes any sense! ;)
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Well, in that case, you should probably inform them. I left that forum for good, and I don't want anyone to think I'm returning.
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Well, in that case, you should probably inform them. I left that forum for good, and I don't want anyone to think I'm returning.
Heh, what the? I thought all was chummy and addictive in those parts. I'm pretty well invisible to all over there with my scattered posts, but I guess if I can somehow find an apt time/manner to bring up Roguetemple's hopeful livening then I'll try.
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Heh, what the? I thought all was chummy and addictive in those parts.
It is, which made leaving damn hard. I had my reasons. Anyway, that's a story for another thread.
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Did you notice all the roguelike projects cropping up in "creative projects" recently ?
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Huh, odd. I didn't notice until you mentioned it.
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Happened across some the other day when making that TrueSpace posting that may or may not actually draw any interest over there. On my end, I'd reckon on olive branch extending as they get further along and Roguetemple gains some signs of change as well (like how I haven't gotten around to any kinda Youtube channel quite yet...)