The Temple is crumbling down...

[Krice]

I know people have left because of toxic comments since they've explicitly said so.

They can say whatever they want, wont make it true. Saying something is "toxic" means nothing, that's why you can't have a real conversation with these.. people. They don't have real arguments or even motivation to interact with you like normal people would. All they want is promote their game and force everyone to agree with them.

[AgingMinotaur]

Saying something is "toxic" means nothing

It actually does, though, even if the term is clicheed and not seldomly misused (I'll grant you that). You're making the same mistake that many other, less than averagely gifted nerds have made before you, namely to assume that anything that falls outside your scope of comprehension is either stupid or meaningless.

Anyway, I don't think this is a very fruitful discussion, and I seem to recall having had it once or twice with you before I certainly won't dictate how this place should be moderated, and personally somewhat like the fact that temple threads are allowed to go their natural course. I also get that you're half joking a lot of the time, but I can't blame people who feel they've better things to do with their time than getting randomly trolled online.

As always,
Minotauros

[Troubler]

the consensus that did implicitly get established, is that women, gays etc. are only welcome as long as they accept verbal abuse at random intervals

That can't be the consensus if we are arguing over it right now. It can't be the consensus when half of the opinions I've read are calling for stricter moderation.
But if this becomes the consensus, it is only because it's opponents are leaving to make it so. I would rather they stay, but the issue is they don't want to argue.
They just want satisfaction. Instead of complaining, they can now go somewhere else to actually get it. There are already places that exist that are:

1.More popular
2.Hold their consensus
3.Have roguelike discussion

I don't think it's limited to political views either. I remember someone here threatening to leave if roguelites were not excluded from the site.
In fact, this whole issue over the definition of a roguelike. People seem opposed to even having the argument, and why? We had it and nothing bad happened.
It was not fruitless and it was not toxic. It was a discussion on a discussion board. That's all it needs to be.

I am sick of always hearing one side of the story everywhere I go.
We don't have to all get along. Usually I'm glad that we don't.

[Krice]

You're making the same mistake that many other, less than averagely gifted nerds have made before you

Really. We are going into this? What was your roguelike project again? I can't remember everyone, but I think you were not even a game developer yourself. So you got pretty large mouth in that sense.

[AgingMinotaur]

I remember someone here threatening to leave if roguelites were not excluded from the site.

That's really not what I was talking about, but since you mention it, the user you're thinking about would probably be Krice, who has been whining about this for years. I'm personally fine with that; what I find distressing is the fact that blatantly racist and sexist comments (from several users) have been met with no other consequence than the occasional pushback from other users. I'd love to live in a world where we could be welcoming of everyone, including bigots, but I'm afraid reality simply doesn't work that way.

What was your roguelike project again? I can't remember everyone, but I think you were not even a game developer yourself. So you got pretty large mouth in that sense.

Not that it's my responsibility to do your research, but yes, I did finish one roguelike in addition to my current unfinished hobby project, which is also publicly available. Gamedev is not my primary creative endeavor, though, as I've been busy publishing several critically acclaimed books to feed myself and my family. In the meantime, you released Teemu, which was a pretty cute miniature crpg. You may not remember that I was one of the few people who payed any attention to that? I liked the fact that it included hattifnatter and disguising yourself as a pirate, but seeing as how it has zero replay value and no emergent/procedural content, I found it pretty rich that you of all people released that to the rl community. So in answer to your question: No, I'm not horribly saddened or insulted by the fact that you can't be bothered to keep up with the rest of the rl community. You can come back and talk about meritocracy when you've released Kaduria, okay?

As always,
Minotauros

[Krice]

You can come back and talk about meritocracy when you've released Kaduria, okay?

You don't seem to understand that it wont change anything about this forum and the way we disagree with alleged "toxicity". Pseudo-arguments like that are much more common in other social media, not in forums, so it's even difficult to understand why someone would force it in here. Maybe it's because you are an american, everything weird seems to come from there.

[AgingMinotaur]

Pseudo-arguments like that […] it's even difficult to understand why someone would force it in here.

Well, you're the one who brought it up, so you tell me, I guess? You really are making a complete ass of yourself.

As always.

[Krice]

Well, you're the one who brought it up, so you tell me, I guess? You really are making a complete ass of yourself.

I'll tell you what, there is no "toxic" stuff here so you might go to somewhere else, some social media where it exists in the twisted minds of people like you.

[Krice]

Teemu, which was a pretty cute miniature crpg.

According to Berlin interpretation, Teemu has 7/9 of "high value factors" as roguelike which I find hilarious. In my opinion the current release version of Teemu is a roguelike-style adventure game. It doesn't yet have a RPG system (only very simple one).

[Troubler]

no other consequence than the occasional pushback from other users.

That seems like a fair exchange to me, but what do I know?
This really isn't something we can just "agree to disagree" on.

For my own sanity though, I'm just glad the people looking for stricter moderation didn't get their way. It's still too bad they won't be staying.
As for whoever would benefit from that strict moderation, what I should say is, I owe them about as much consideration as they would make for me.
Seeing how I've enjoyed most of the discussions we've had so far, I would rather nobody step in to interrupt them for what I see as unnecessary.
I would also rather not risk getting banned in the event that I would disagree with an authority figure. I'd rather not even have it on my mind.

If the current situation is not meant to last, one way or another, then that's life.
Until then, I can't complain. I'm pretty happy with how things have been handled.
I hope your friends come around. They probably wont, but really that's all I can offer.

[AgingMinotaur]

According to Berlin interpretation, Teemu has 7/9 of "high value factors" as roguelike which I find hilarious. In my opinion the current release version of Teemu is a roguelike-style adventure game.

In defense of the Berlin int , I think it works better when applied in good faith rather than to prove the roguelikeness of eg. Minesweeper. Thus the definition text states that factors like exploration  and permadeath (in the RL sense) relies on random generation to work. I haven't played the latest version of Teemu, though, so can't say anything about that.

As always,
Minotauros