Author Topic: Theory about popularity of languages  (Read 31527 times)

Aukustus

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 440
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • The Temple of Torment
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #30 on: September 17, 2014, 08:31:46 PM »
Maybe I should point out that this was on Windows 8.1. Is that maybe the difference? I've tried double clicking, and it didn't work (but I know python is installed because I can open IDLE and type things like 2+3 and get the right answer). I'm kind of interested in trying this again now that I've started. This just further proves my point.

I've developed Python on XP, Windows 7 and Windows 8 and it works out of the box by double clicking. I put a simple
Code: [Select]
a = 5
print(a)
raw_input()
and it opens a console window with title "C:\Python27\python.exe" and displays 5 and it waits for enter.

Kevin Granade

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 83
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #31 on: September 18, 2014, 03:34:10 AM »
Some (or more like most) languages have roots in hacky environments like unix/linux with complex setup rituals only few people are willing to withstand
Hahah, that's a good one, you DO know that c and c++ were developed for and on UNIX, right?  ...right?

Also calling UNIX a 'hacky' environment, as opposed to Windows of all things, wow.

koiwai

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 99
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #32 on: September 18, 2014, 05:33:16 AM »
Quote from: koiwai
Modern graphical interfaces of OSX and Windows are simply not designed for developers, so they install IDEs <...> They try to hide the real paths of the files and substitute them with GUI dialogs and conceptual "Documents", "Pictures", etc.
It's true that Windows and OSX are designed for general use rather than development use, but even on linux a good IDE makes a huge difference to working on any non-trivial project.

I agree, complex programming systems like Java may be unwieldy without a good IDE. About a year ago, I thought about writing a game for Android, read about it, installed SDK. An IDE like Eclipse (or NetBeans) just ties all the pieces together, and it must be very convenient.

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #33 on: September 18, 2014, 12:43:01 PM »
You seem to miss the crucial point: Only if it works! (Which it won't because Visual Studio won't know where python is located.)

Python must be the problem in that case.

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #34 on: September 18, 2014, 12:45:33 PM »
Hahah, that's a good one, you DO know that c and c++ were developed for and on UNIX, right?  ...right

I think the possible answer is that Windows was not invented when C and C++ were first developed. Yes, I was right. Quick look at wikipedia tells: C++ - 1983, Windows 1.0 - 1985.

reaver

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 207
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #35 on: September 18, 2014, 01:53:25 PM »
All hail Krice the mega-troll, baiting otherwise intelligent people with ludicrous and (nerd-)enraging statements into commenting over multiple pages. Has nobody ever heard of "casting pearls before swine" or "preach to deaf ears"?

mushroom patch

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 554
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #36 on: September 18, 2014, 02:01:04 PM »
You give him too much credit. This is fairly standard Slashdot trolling material circa 1999. He does a good job of building a believable persona of ignorant petulance as a vehicle for trolling, but it's pretty old fashioned, facile stuff at the end of the day.

reaver

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 207
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #37 on: September 18, 2014, 02:07:04 PM »
You give him too much credit. This is fairly standard Slashdot trolling material circa 1999. He does a good job of building a believable persona of ignorant petulance as a vehicle for trolling, but it's pretty old fashioned, facile stuff at the end of the day.

No, I'm not, we're on the 3rd page already. On a subject called "Theory about popularity of languages" from a person who probably knows and has worked on 1, on a single platform. And people give serious responses. If I'm to choose between people being stupid or him being a good troll, I'll choose the latter.
So, no, I'm not.

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #38 on: September 18, 2014, 02:42:39 PM »
from a person who probably knows and has worked on 1, on a single platform.

Teemu can be compiled directly without changes on VC++ and gcc, and on Windows and Linux. MacOS compilation needed some minor changes in how SDL was included. Can your game do the same?

reaver

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 207
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #39 on: September 18, 2014, 03:03:00 PM »
Teemu can be compiled directly without changes on VC++ and gcc, and on Windows and Linux. MacOS compilation needed some minor changes in how SDL was included.

Ok, fair enough, my bad assumption.

Can your game do the same?

Now begone troll, go pester those who actually listen about your theories derived from your cluelessness. I like to have conversations, not engage in some unbacked e-peen competitions.

mushroom patch

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 554
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #40 on: September 18, 2014, 03:17:22 PM »
You give him too much credit. This is fairly standard Slashdot trolling material circa 1999. He does a good job of building a believable persona of ignorant petulance as a vehicle for trolling, but it's pretty old fashioned, facile stuff at the end of the day.

No, I'm not, we're on the 3rd page already. On a subject called "Theory about popularity of languages" from a person who probably knows and has worked on 1, on a single platform. And people give serious responses. If I'm to choose between people being stupid or him being a good troll, I'll choose the latter.
So, no, I'm not.

People respond to trolls out of lack of experience and a trusting nature, not stupidity. I suppose there's also an element of believing there's something to be accomplished in discussing nonsense like this, the basis of which belief reasonable people could disagree about. Stupidity might be a little harsh, but I respect your opinion on that count.

AgingMinotaur

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 805
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • Original Discriminating Buffalo Man
    • View Profile
    • Land of Strangers
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #41 on: September 21, 2014, 09:39:04 PM »
People, thanks for various hints re: android. Unity actually looks interesting for a number of reasons, but there's no Linux version of their dev tools unless I cough up 1500 bucks, it seems. (So there you have it, a tangible disadvantage to using Linux (and one of many, as I may add) ;)) Anyway, I'll give the other options that were mentioned, a tug, and see where I end up.

As always,
Minotauros
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2014, 03:11:55 PM »
F# is quite interesting, funny and it's supported by Visual Studio! I just don't seem to get a lot out from reading about F#, should some day try to write some real life code like for example a small roguelike.

DarkGod

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 137
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #43 on: October 15, 2014, 04:04:44 PM »
People, thanks for various hints re: android. Unity actually looks interesting for a number of reasons, but there's no Linux version of their dev tools unless I cough up 1500 bucks, it seems. (So there you have it, a tangible disadvantage to using Linux (and one of many, as I may add) ;)) Anyway, I'll give the other options that were mentioned, a tug, and see where I end up.

As always,
Minotauros

Funny that, I see it as a tangible disadvantage to using unity myself ;)

AgingMinotaur

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 805
  • Karma: +2/-0
  • Original Discriminating Buffalo Man
    • View Profile
    • Land of Strangers
Re: Theory about popularity of languages
« Reply #44 on: October 15, 2014, 07:34:35 PM »
That's an angle I completely approve of, of course :D What I found appealing with Unity, was the cross-platform aspect, ironically. But I came over an open source alternative called Godot (MIT License, compiles to Android and iOS as well as desktops and a few other devices). It seems quite decent to my needs, so I've decided to try that for the moment. Java would probably have been the "better" option, rationally speaking, and I'd never even actually considered using a game engine as opposed to mucking about with compilers et al in my beloved terminal, but I thought, meh why not try something new?

I'm sure it will feel limiting at times, but on the bright side it's quite quick to pick up and play with. After just a few evenings of bungling around with the (rather incomplete) documentation, I've learned some basics and put together an almost finished Pooyan clone :P The engine uses a scripting language similar to Python, but stuff like the main loop, redrawing the screen etc. is kept out of sight. To a perpetual noob like me, it might be a good companion, but there's of course a special pleasure (and, probably, consistency of vision in the ensuing game/program) to be had from writing stuff like engine and interface yourself.

Speaking of which, I need to get back and give Land of Strangers some loving soon. I was just about to add some intelligence and personality to the NPCs. Just having a few quite hectic months, ahem.

As always,
Minotauros

tl;dr: Godot seems like a good alternative for anyone looking for a game engine.
This matir, as laborintus, Dedalus hous, hath many halkes and hurnes ... wyndynges and wrynkelynges.