Author Topic: Burn Out  (Read 22323 times)

Paul Jeffries

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #15 on: November 10, 2012, 01:14:42 PM »
I don't know. It feels like you have to force yourself. One problem is that when you get older games somehow are not interesting anymore. So it's quite difficult to get excited about them. When you are young everything is more interesting and there is something to reach for. Or maybe I'm just depressed.

Yeah, I don't think forcing yourself is ideal, but the way I look at it is: it takes a lot less force to get myself to work on something that I last worked on yesterday than it does to force myself to work on something that I haven't looked at for a month.

I also actually find being a hollow, bitter and cynical old man to be an advantage in some ways - when I was a kid I could never finish anything because as soon as I got a tenth of the way through I would have some other (in my mind) brilliant idea and I would have to drop everything to start working on that instead.

Of course everybody is different and gets motivated in different ways, so there's every chance that I'm just a freakish anomaly with tentacles for arms.

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2012, 05:21:23 AM »
I think when we were younger it was easier to latch on to one thing and get really obsessed with it. Burn out was never an issue back then.

I agree Darren, I remember finding all the secret rooms in The Legend of Zelda. All of them. Pre-Internet. I had the entire thing mapped out on graph paper. Did the same thing with Metroid.

Nowadays it takes 60 seconds for my computer to start and I'm irked at the time wasted.

Another thing I think affects me is when I play other people's games, see how great they are, and am like "Well...might at well just play that one." This happened with Gunfist, there are just a ton of procedural shooters out there that are 10x better. So you are left with only the joy of creation, turns out it's not enough sometimes.

I find that with card games I can pump them out quicker and easier, lower risk of burn out, but the medium can be a bit limited. Solo play against the system is hard to make interesting, and in doing so you can sacrifice the face to face fun which tabletop games should really foster. You also cannot simply distribute via free download and expect many people to click and play. People have to actually print things out, so that's a barrier to sharing.

So then you think, "Oh, well I'll just take my card game idea into a computer game everyone can play," finding yourself right back where you started. Bogged down.

Also I really want to make a fully realized procedurally generated real time strategy world town/base building tower defense sim where, when you get enough money, you can outfit a hero to go shut down the dungeons that keep spawning monsters to attack your town/base. The hero controls as in a gauntlet-like hack and slash splatterfest. Multiplayer. Online. Invite your friends. Elf needs more residential zones.

You can't really do that in a card game, unless your idea of a good game includes hundreds of pieces, multiple boards and a 24 hour play time...wait...that would awesome...I should make that game...but not many people will print and play something that big...so maybe I'll program it...ENDLESS LOOP CRASH!!!!!!   :D

roocey

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #17 on: November 14, 2012, 03:50:33 PM »
Yeah, I don't think forcing yourself is ideal, but the way I look at it is: it takes a lot less force to get myself to work on something that I last worked on yesterday than it does to force myself to work on something that I haven't looked at for a month.

I also actually find being a hollow, bitter and cynical old man to be an advantage in some ways - when I was a kid I could never finish anything because as soon as I got a tenth of the way through I would have some other (in my mind) brilliant idea and I would have to drop everything to start working on that instead.

While I'm hardly an expert on the topic, I think it might also have to do with how long someone has been developing. I'm 19 and I've been making games and modding things for around 5 years. The first three years or so were a big creative rush for me. I rarely stuck to an idea for more than a month. The past two years or so I've focused more on actual programming and really just my one project (@Star Wars).

Anyone who has perused my blog will know that @Star Wars went through quite a few iterations before becoming @Star Wars, but I think that's a little different than constantly hopping through ideas. Even when my game was simply "sneak", I had a lot of the same basic ideas and philosophy that I continue to utilize now. Beyond that, I would argue the generic fantasy genre that "sneak" started off in is a good place to flesh out some basic mechanics, get a feel for your systems, and what you might need going forward.

On the titular topic, I don't think I've gotten burnt out since I started "sneak". Occasionally a bug will make me take a break for a couple days. Sometimes I'll voluntarily take a break for a couple weeks. I don't really see that as burning out because, when I'm on those "vacations", I tend to be thinking of ways to improve and add-on to the existing game. Basically, if I go a week or two without looking at the source code, that doesn't necessarily mean I've stopped working.

Obviously what I do isn't going to work for everyone. Some people need to make a living or just simply want to satisfy a deadline. At this stage of my life, I don't necessarily need either of those things. So I've got quite a bit of freedom to take breaks and redesign major elements of my game.

As a parting piece, I will say that I tend to get a bit energized from compliments, criticisms, new follows - really any interaction with whatever community is forming near or around my game. Which is not to say that I need that social element to build the game, just that it gives me a bit of renewed energy. Just as a forum-relevant example, after I watched Game Hunter's review of my game, I got into a bit of a programming frenzy and now I'm chock full of plans for the future and ready to roll.

Andrew Wright, developer of Dead Man Walking, Android Loves Kitty, Grid, Iron Fist, and Lost Valkyrie.   This is my development blog!
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Darren Grey

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #18 on: November 14, 2012, 04:33:41 PM »
I find criticism more motivating than praise, personally.  Or direct requests for "change this, change that".  Always a good kick up the arse to get back into the code.

roocey

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #19 on: November 14, 2012, 05:12:38 PM »
I find criticism more motivating than praise, personally.  Or direct requests for "change this, change that".  Always a good kick up the arse to get back into the code.

Agreed. While I would never turn down praise, (constructive) criticism is more useful to me. While I can't claim to speak for every solo designer out there, I think criticism is doubly useful for me because I'm working alone. For example, I stopped updating the help screens and such for a while because I don't need them. Criticism reminded me that more people than just myself have and will play my game, so I try to tread a little more carefully there and keep the manuals up-to-date.
Andrew Wright, developer of Dead Man Walking, Android Loves Kitty, Grid, Iron Fist, and Lost Valkyrie.   This is my development blog!
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Krice

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #20 on: November 15, 2012, 09:24:27 AM »
On the titular topic, I don't think I've gotten burnt out since I started "sneak". Occasionally a bug will make me take a break for a couple days.

I think it's extremely rare for people under 25 year to experience a real burn out or generic depression. I didn't know what burn out was when I was 20. You can kick ass all the time without getting tired.

roocey

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #21 on: November 15, 2012, 03:00:23 PM »
On the titular topic, I don't think I've gotten burnt out since I started "sneak". Occasionally a bug will make me take a break for a couple days.

I think it's extremely rare for people under 25 year to experience a real burn out or generic depression. I didn't know what burn out was when I was 20. You can kick ass all the time without getting tired.

Fair enough. Like I said, I can hardly claim to be an expert on the topic. That's just been my experience thus far. I'll give you an update in a few years! ;D
Andrew Wright, developer of Dead Man Walking, Android Loves Kitty, Grid, Iron Fist, and Lost Valkyrie.   This is my development blog!
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tuturto

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #22 on: November 16, 2012, 06:46:08 AM »
On the titular topic, I don't think I've gotten burnt out since I started "sneak". Occasionally a bug will make me take a break for a couple days.

I think it's extremely rare for people under 25 year to experience a real burn out or generic depression. I didn't know what burn out was when I was 20. You can kick ass all the time without getting tired.

Except that 5%-10% of young people in Finland are or have been suffering for serious depression. 15% of boys and 25% of girls have had suicidal feelings. I find those numbers really high and wouldn't say it's rare.
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TheCreator

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #23 on: November 16, 2012, 06:54:19 AM »
Except that 5%-10% of young people in Finland are or have been suffering for serious depression. 15% of boys and 25% of girls have had suicidal feelings. I find those numbers really high and wouldn't say it's rare.

I don't think one can suffer from depression having a good roguelike project to work on ;). If you can do something you really love to do, you don't fall into a real depression. Suicide is for losers who can't program. I mean, I have suicidal thought every once a week, but they're never serious. I guess it's because sometimes I don't have access to my code for more than an hour :).
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Darren Grey

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #24 on: November 16, 2012, 08:30:14 AM »
I could never commit suicide with my code in the state it's in! Just one more commit and then I can consider... ;)

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #25 on: November 17, 2012, 11:45:58 AM »
  Suicide, depression...goddamn you morbid mofos!  :-*

 

Krice

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #26 on: November 17, 2012, 12:56:33 PM »
Except that 5%-10% of young people in Finland are or have been suffering for serious depression. 15% of boys and 25% of girls have had suicidal feelings.

I think "depression" and even suicides are a strange trend in Finland among young people. I don't know what the heck is the problem, but it can't be anything real problems, because in this country you don't have to face real problems until you are adult and try to survive on your own. I think there are similar trouble with young people in many countries. One great example is Japan, like hikikomoris. I mean, someone needs to punch those hikikomoris on the face to wake them up.

tuturto

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #27 on: November 17, 2012, 04:29:10 PM »
I think "depression" and even suicides are a strange trend in Finland among young people. I don't know what the heck is the problem, but it can't be anything real problems, because in this country you don't have to face real problems until you are adult and try to survive on your own.

Not understanding it doesn't mean that it is not there (otherwise the world would be really small and consist of simple things and simple people). Real depression and burn out are scary and sad things to witness, regardless if the one going through them is young or old.
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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #28 on: November 17, 2012, 09:07:19 PM »
  Hell I burnt out, but not mentally. My body just gave out under the stress of law practice. Minds and bodies can be fragile.

Krice

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Re: Burn Out
« Reply #29 on: November 18, 2012, 09:27:36 AM »
My body just gave out under the stress of law practice.

Burn out is caused by stress and I think it's more physical than depression that usually has no rational explanation. On the other hand I think you need also motivation, something that drives you to do whatever you do. Without motivation it's easier to burn out.