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1

Early Dev / Re: MicRogue

« on: June 15, 2012, 06:53:17 PM »

i dont know if randomised combat is necessarily what will make a combat system a roguelike-type system but it helps significantly. the reason is that the sequence of misses and criticals and variable damage means that the outcome of any given battle is in question, aka you cannot really know the result of the combat until AFTER you've commited to it. and the fact that you must commit to find out is important because that means you are using your abilities, potions, scrolls , hp and/or turns on a battle that you might not win. it also means that with every miss you make, you're supposed to take into account whether or not the new situation is winnable and if you shouldnt just back off. when the combat is completely deterministic, then the results of a fight/fights are determinable before the fights are made and so, the scenario boils down to a puzzle situation, where you can see the elements and their interactions clearly and be able to plan exactly what move will lead to what result  at every turn. the reason it becomes a puzzle situation is because the only thing that matters now is to pick the exact sequence of moves that will give you the optimal result.

another way of looking at it is that roguelike combat work based on picking options based on incomplete information. whether or not youll hit or not, whether or not more monsters will appear out of nowhere and swarm you, all contribute to a game where you are unable to determine the exact optimal moves for a large part of the game and so you must a) approximate the best sequence of moves to maximise your ability to proceed and b) prepare for alot of eventualities that may occur because you arent quite sure that you can always pick fights on your own terms. this is why deterministic combat and roguelike combat dont generally mix, the mindset is a different. it can be possible but you wont come up with a traditional roguelike id imagine



"Also you keep mentioning making my game something its not. I was just wondering what you meant by that. the best way I can describe this game so far is the same way some people describe sculpting with clay. The sculpture is in there I just need to carve it out. thats what this design process has been, lots of adding and subtracting to test. That said, if you could give me some examples, all feedback really helps."

well because of the deterministic combat, full knowledge of the game board and roughly known monster a.i., there is a) the possibility of solving each dungeon floor optimally. the game does not require you to take risks per se or deal with incomplete information and distances itself alot from conventional roguelike traditions.

however, i dont think this is a bad thing because the game you have right now, as a result of so much determinism,is a very nice puzzle game. the monsters interact with the player movement and game board in interesting ways and the random enemy spawns at the start of the game board keeps it relatively fresh. things like equipment or spells might add something but can also, detract from the feel of the game. because the puzzle elements come from the interaction of the games with full knowledge available and a recurring theme in roguelikes is incomplete knowledge of the situation, it feels like the two game directions are at odds to each other. while i can respect wanting to stick to your original vision, i felt that someone should mention that the game you have right now is very nice in its own right but might not stay that way the more you try and make it more roguelike-ish.



the idea of the rats is fine but the execution can lead to alot of unwinnable situations. a monster where it is incredibly desirable that you actively avoid combat is nice but the rats multiplay insanely quickly at times. theres also the fact that it interacts in weird ways with other elements, it is entirely possible for me to step forward, stab a rat, be swapped by an eye and then be killing by a spawned rat from the kill i just made, all in one round.

one of the nicer things i like is that the fluid and spartan game messages help keep it fast-paced but also make it feel a little on edge, a feeling i like in my games of survival and wits. i feel adding a new death message or shiny bars would detract from the ambience of the game but thats just me.

if you want to show players why they died, you could try highlighting it with a border or something when they die

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Early Dev / Re: MicRogue

« on: June 14, 2012, 01:32:24 PM »

hi, i checked out this game from the roguelike radio. and i felt compelled to give feedback.

this game is not a roguelike - the random generation of monsters per level does not really justify the label when the combat is deterministic and the level lay-out is fixed at the start.

HOWEVER, this game is amazing! ive already linked it to every friend who could possibly be interested in the game; the simplicity and yet the abstraction involved makes this game incredibly fun and incredibly challenging at times. ive not gone too far but i feel that you have a game here that, if you allowed to be its own thing and not conform to roguelike standards, would be an incredibly beautiful puzzle game. the aesthetics are nice, the gameplay i cant stop gushing about and the music and execution of the game is nice.

i know it probably doesnt count for much and i know that it can be easy to want to build the game the way you originally desired it to go but this idea and this execution is one of the most interesting ive seen in a long time. for how simple it is, it has held my attention far more than anything more complex has

i do have 2 complaints/suggestions though. it feels that some maps are unwinnable, particularly in the sideways I shaped rooms with a rat and another monster. the rat multiplies out of control and two monsters barreling down the corridor makes it almost impossible to deal with it unless a monster moves in random place in the corner and if its the rat, your basicly dead. the other is that the turn timer is actually really good but it feels like it needs a little tweaking. its easy to stockpile it up on easier levels and barring facing some unwinnable situation that needs you to burn turns to pray for a random movement, youll never really deplete. id suggest placing an upper limit on the amount of turns you can save up. the mechanic is good, it creates that tense feeling at times but without a maximum cap, it becomes meaningless later

anyway, sorry to ramble but this game really excited me i again want to stress that, as the opinion of a random voice on the internet, your game idea is actually really streamlined and really fun and i feel if you try and make it into something its not, youll lose alot of what makes it really interesting, to me at least. you dont need fancy stuff, the puzzle element of this game shines through and you shouldnt be ashamed of it, it is a success, even if its not the success you wanted.