Temple of The Roguelike Forums
Development => Design => Topic started by: guest509 on September 20, 2013, 03:04:13 AM
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EDIT: How about I just turn this into an open source table top RPG...?
<YES, I RAMBLE...I think it's worth it?>
Still completely failing at designing a Super Hero RL game of 'Rogue' level complexity. So not too complex.
Anyone got any pointers on a system that might achieve this?
So far i've been going with a super simple stat + power system.
Stats
-Hits: Number of hits you can take before being KO'd
-Attack: Dice to roll to hit.
-Defense: Hits to ignore each turn.
-Move: Actions per 'round' of 12 clicks.
-Energy: How fast your abilities reset.
Passive Slots (Always on)
Active Slots (Take an action)
Game flow would not be a dungeon dive, but you can't really do an open world type of things so easily...Maybe I could have an overworld of a large city, with various bad guy lairs. Thugs come out at night, commit different crimes and such. You can go back to your hideout to heal overnight, but then the low level baddies will respawn and the high level villians might move their lair.
I don't know what I'd do for leveling really, I might not do it at all, but you really do want to have some character progression. Perhaps every time you beat a boss villian you can choose a stat to increase. It won't be a gear grinder, that's not really what Superhero games are about. They are more about beating bad guys, going on missions.
I do want to have a 'score' system that tracks the number of villians your hero has taken out. After taking out 9 (or 3, or 5, I dunno) you can then face your Arch Nemesis who shows up at your hideout to do battle with you. Also at some point the police will take notice and you'll have to avoid them.
I'd like for the Villians to be somewhat randomized, we'll see how that goes.
One major weakness is the powers. Everyone wants the unique and awesome powers in a superhero game. But that's very tough to do, so you'd have to make the powers generic. Ranged Attack power could be fire ball, ice blast, magic missile, gun, bow, etc...it's hard to hold onto the flavor.
Take Cyclops for instance. His one power will be a rank 5 optic blast. A single target ranged attack. Then he'll have a passive (x-man suit) that adds defense. Maybe a hand to hand passive that ups his bump attack. A high 'energy' score so he can blast away frequently. His origin will be 'mutant', with maybe some flavor text.
Then take Punisher as a second example. He has a lower rank blast (guns), and maybe a blast + area (grenade) ability. Then the same passive defense suit and bump attack bonus (knife). His origin would be 'hardware' with some flavor text.
Taking those two characters as examples I worry that it would be too washed out. Too samey.
I guess there's really only one way to find out. Prototype.
Other Thoughts: Don't get me started on MOVEMENT powers. If you cannot wall crawl and/or fly it's not really a super hero game...that's sorta tough to do though...hmm...I guess wall crawl and fly could be a sort of + move and 'stealth status effect' as well as 'ignore obstacle status effect'...
-Speaking of stealth. Double damage on unaware enemies, of course...guard dogs (1 hit, aggressive behavior, Powers of ALERT/ALARM and DETECT STEALTH)...:-)
-I can have several preset archetypes and also a build your own, where you can choose the generic powers and name them yourself for flavor? For example you could make the same 'cyclops' type character with Power Glove Blast (Blast +5), Passive Power Glove Block (Defense +3) and Power Glove Slap (Bump +2). Plus, I dunno, Steroid User (+3 Hits, -50% testicles)
-And of course other character but blasters must be possible, like Brawlers (wolverine), brawler/gadgeteers (batman) and Mega-Heroes (SUPERMAN!).
-Maybe you have so many 'power points' to build your character, and that corresponds with the difficulty of the game...so you can make a Superman type character but the game will make super villians too...? Or you can play a simple cop with vest (+1 def) and pistol (blast 1) and baton/mace (Bump +1).
-World spanning creatures will probably be too much, like those that eat worlds and stuff. But alien invasions through worm holes should be not a problem, alien grunt = (3 hits, aggressive behavior, blast +2 'lazer gun')
-also your popularity should come into play, it will affect how people treat you, and when the cops finally turn on you. Also there should be some draw backs...okay now I'm going too far...
ANYONE HAVE ANY POINTERS? I KNOW IT'S JUST A TALKIE, BUT STILL IT COULD BE FUN TO PLAY WITH THE DESIGN!
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Yes. Definitely need 'popularity' as a stat that can increase and decrease.
Mutants will get a minus to popularity, but an extra hero point.
The (+ popularity) can be themed as Good Looks, Tight Spandex, etc...
The (- popularity) can be themed as Underpants on the Outside, Blue Skin, etc...
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Wolverine might be boring under this system. Unless you make the claws a complex skill.
Passive: Regeneration (energy + to HP each turn)
Passive: Metal Skeleton (+HP)
Active: Claws (+5 bump attack, -5 popularity) - So he catches way more police heat when his claws are out....
Depending on how I handle the 'energy' stat the claws will not be able to stay out long, and regeneration might take energy...I dunno. You could make the regen an active skill that uses energy...
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The Hulk would be fun:
Active: Hulk Out (Buff Stats +10) Drawback (popularity - 10)
Active: Hulk Smash (Area Attack + 5) Drawback (dependent on being Hulked Out)
I'd have to figure out how to make an ability dependent on the activation of another ability...
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And while I'm at it...
WORF! -origin- Alien/Hardware
-Passive: Battleth (+3 bump attack)
-Active: Phaser (+3 ranged attack)
-Active: Hypo Spray (+10 heal) Drawback (single use)
-Passive: Boney Head (resist stun) Drawback (popularity - 3)
:-)
Feel free to post your own, I'll get ideas on how to actually make the system...
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I figure a low ENERGY character who has a huge power, like a rank 10 blast or something, would be drained and not be able to use their powers again for a bit...
But how would one model that? Realm of the Mad God has an energy bar that fills quickly depending on the stats, and when you use your special power it pretty much drains all the way down.
I can do it that way, a Rank 1 power lowers ENERGY by 10%, a Rank 10 is the highest and takes all your energy. It refills fast by resting? It also refills each turn by the amount of your 'energy' stat.
So the energy stat would be a recharge stat. And you'd have two status bars. Hits/Total Hits and Energy(0-100%).
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...I continue to spam my own thread...
There has to be some sort of throwing mechanic. If you don't have that then characters with high strength are less interesting, as our telekinetics.
For example Jean Grey can move things with her mind. Say she has Telekinesis (Ranged Move/Push, Rank 3). She can move an item in sight 3 squares, and whack it into baddies too. So the objects on the field need to be given a weight. 1-10. Jean can move an item up to rank 3, she can move it 3 squares, and it does damage to whoever it hits depending on its weight (or maybe depending on Jean's rank, I'd have to test that).
The Hulk can have the power Toss (Throw, Rank 10). So he can toss the largest object in the game, like a bus, 10 squares. Provided he is adjacent to said object.
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...and my self spam continues.... :P
MIND CONTROL!
-Okay, now here's a TOUGH thing to implement. So I'll just have to steal from Brogue. Yep!
We'll call the generic ability to be CHARM or ALLY. Not sure how it will scale by power rank or energy usage, but essentially it will create minions that run around helping you. Basically flipping the AI from 'target player' to 'target closest bad guy'...could be a mess.
You cannot have Professor X without this power though...
Once you figure out how to do the 'charm' thing you can easily implement...
SIDEKICKS! Batman needs a Robin, am I right? You know it! Programming wise this would just be a permanent minion. Like the dog in Nethack.
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...at this point Shock Frost is getting jealous...
What about Kitty Pride? We'll model her as high energy with a good movement power, movement powers ignore terrain, basically.
What about Mystique? High energy + Stealth Toggle with some + defense and bump abilities.
Magneto? That's where we have a problem unless we give every movable object in the game a 'metal' or not stat. In the city pretty much everything can have metal so we can just model him as a high rank Telekinesis with a flight/movement power. But what if we have a 'forest' zone outside of town? We'd give him Telekinesis with drawback Metal Only.
Night Crawler? Teleport shouldn't be too hard to implement, most roguelikes have it.
Dr. Strange? fuck you....:-(
The Flash - Move score of 10 or 12. Bullet speed basically. TONS of actions each turn. Tons of defense too, he's so hard to hit!
Swamp Thing - Plant control...hmmm...we can give objects an 'organic' tag and give him CHARM with drawback Organic Only.
Nuclear Man - Passive: BUFF!, Drawback: Outside only. Day only.
Black Panther - Stealth, drawback: Night only.
Lex Luthor? Some sort of high popularity score and massive charm ability or something. Or you could do the lex luthor with the kryptonite suit with tons of defense and a solid ranged blast.
Iron Man - Movement/Flight, Blast, Passive: Defense+. With a high popularity stat.
Thor - Flight, Tons of HP, HUGE bump attack (hammer) and nice area blast (lightening)...
I could do this all night...
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Robocop
-Origin: Cyborg, Human Experiment
-Active: Gun (blast, rank 3)
-Passive: Body Armor (defense + 3)
-Passive: Police Man (popularity +5) [Popularity is not just how street people act, but mostly how the cops, government and military react]
Drawbacks and Traits
-Metal [i can see later this being important]
-Computerized [for later additions of computer scrambling abilities, like kitty pride, magneto and doctor doom]
Edward Cullen
-Origin: Fantastic Creature (vampire)
-Passive: BUFF (all stats +)
-Passive: Beautiful (popularity +) drawback: night or underground only.
-Active: Drain (take and gain HP, rank 8) drawback: Horrifying [popularity negative, not sure how to implement]
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There is a tabletop RPG called 'HERO System' that contains ridiculously involved rules for power creation.
As an RL I assume you want pretty quick character generation. Something I thought of for a game I may write is you take the name, hash it, and use that as a seed to procedurally generate a super hero (complete with powers that have generated effects and flavour text).
The same game idea had the following for advancement - when you 'die' (or trigger it manually) you get a second wind: a permanent power buff, full heal and a little extra back story explained/generated; but you only have 2-3 of these. You're then seeing how much fame/popularity you can get before dying 3 times.
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The thing about superheroes is that they don't really have stats with any meaning in normal situations - if they score a hit on anyone that isn't themself superpowered, that person *will* suffer effects anywhere between disabled for a minute or so to instant death (via unconsciousness). The ones that aren't completely invulnerable will have some combination of regeneration, high "hit points", and evasion/shielding. All that tells you is how many bullets or punches you'd have to send in their direction to have a 90% chance of getting a hit, and how many bullets and punches it takes before they give up. Which never happens.
It's all about the abilities, especially in fights between more than one super. Think about the last superhero comic or movie you saw with two supers fighting. Most likely they started off throwing boring normal attacks at each other and having absolutely no effect. Alternatively, one of them might have tried a Worf barrage and watched their enemy dodge every attack, or one of them might have connected with the first hit and put the other on the defensive for the rest of the fight.
That part of the fight doesn't really matter, all it does is establish a power dynamic in the reader's or viewer's head.
The thing that wins superhero fights isn't attrition, but abilities - taking advantage of a weakness, combining a power with someone else's power or an environmental hazard, exposing the enemy to their own attack, etc. etc.
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This page is relevant: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SuperWeight
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You would of course have to include Rogue! Actually, her ability-absorbing powers could be quite interesting - bump enemies to gain their powers temporarily. Could lead to some cool tactical gameplay if you're facing a bunch of enemies of different types and need to plan out how to use their abilities against each other.
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There is a tabletop RPG called 'HERO System' that contains ridiculously involved rules for power creation.
As an RL I assume you want pretty quick character generation.
Yeah man, the HERO system is way too much. Also I'm tailoring it to an RL game...so Hero is way over board, I've also looked at pretty much all of the major Super Hero RPG systems. The one I think is the most applicable making a SuperHeroRL though is the DiabloIII system.
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This page is relevant: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SuperWeight
Superweight, I like it.
That would sort of correspond with character building. You get so many 'power points' to build your character.
Gotta disagree about stats and such only because this is trying to be a game system, not a narrative system. We can argue they are the same, sorta, but I don't get that deep.
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You would of course have to include Rogue! Actually, her ability-absorbing powers could be quite interesting - bump enemies to gain their powers temporarily. Could lead to some cool tactical gameplay if you're facing a bunch of enemies of different types and need to plan out how to use their abilities against each other.
Oh shiz! Good call. Her power would be pretty easy to implement I think, her 'bump' ability would copy over the other person's powers for a number of terms based off of the rank and her 'energy' stat...
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@Quendus - I guess a system could be made that is all about abilities and then hit points or 'KO Resistance' being the only real stat.
You'd have a system like Brogue's. HP and Items make your character, only in this case HP and Powers make up your character.
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I've been kicking around something similar for quite a while too; here's kind of an info dump on what I've been thinking.
The player should always feel powerful. Most enemies should go down in one hit, three tops. And there should be a lot of them. There would of course be champions, who are a lot tougher. And of course the super villains . . .
I wanted to do open world, but it was just a staggering amount of work for something I didn't really want the player to dink around with (exploring an apartment building isn't getting you closer to something actually interesting). So I settled on a linear game (what you called a dungeon dive). The game is divided into progressively longer episodes of several maps with a common theme; there is very little healing available, but the player entirely refreshes between episodes. Episodes have (at least) one supervillain at the end, and an associated story (ie, bank robbery, morlock invasion, etc).
Episodes should culminate in something more interesting that "beat up the bad guy" most of the time. Disarming bombs, evacuating civilians, etc. Of course, the bad guy will be there too . . .
For combat, I'll be doing an attack roll to hit (if 2d12 + attackStat - defenseStat >= 13, it's a hit). Attack stats are shooting, fighting, and throwing. Defense stats are dodge (for ranged), and parry (for melee, or ranged attacks from adjacent squares). Damage is damageRoll - armor. Damage types are energy or physical, and armor applies to them separately (that is, there's a physicalArmor and an energyArmor).
Collateral damage. It's not a comic book if the city doesn't get smashed up.
Interactive environments. Any character can throw debris, if standing in a square of rubble (strong guys can throw bigger things too). Characters have a jump stat; that's how many high-passable squares (like pits, tables, and low walls) they can jump over. For example, a character with a jump of 2 could vault over small pits and tables. A character with a jump of 10 can leap rooftop to rooftop. Characters who can fly cannot jump; they just treat high-passable squares like terrestrial characters treat low-passable squares.
The player chooses a number of powers at the start of the game. One of these is a major power, which has a big impact on how the game plays (essentially picking an archetype). Each power has 5 sequential bonuses the player gets as they put more points into them; however the best benefit is the FIRST on the list. Players get fairly few powers at the start of the game, and a handful more as the game progresses. They do however get a bunch of points to level up their powers, though not enough to max out everything. Shallow power curve. Bonuses from powers can be static or activated abilities.
Activated abilities have a cooldown time. Lower cooldown times can be given as bonuses (ie, the Human Torch type character has reduced cooldown for energy attack powers).
Action points. The player starts each episode with 1 action point, and can have up to 5. When the player uses an action point, they get to take two turns in a row (ie, their next action does not reduce their energy level; I like the ADOM/DoomRL energy system).
Gadgets. The player comes across gadgets; items which can be used a number of times per episode. The could provide temporary buffs (like a jetpack, or force field projector), or activated abilities (like gas grenades or a grappling gun).
Stealth is a thing. Fear is a thing (player characters are, of course, fearless).
I had thought about a reputation system, but I'm more interested in a hackfest, rather than a more resource management-oriented system.
I decided to keep it abstract; The Punisher's gun and Green Arrow's arrow are both ranged physical shooting attacks. I'm going to let the player pick the powers pretty freely; if they want to play Gambit, they shouldn't have to load the game over and over until they get what they want.
I've been trying to get excited about programming it for Android, but I HATE Eclipse, and I'm not so fond of XML. So I'll probably just do it for console. I'm working under the title "Rogue City Heroes."
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One thing that could make the 'energy' stat more interesting is if it were tied in thematically with the source of that character's powers.
For example: Superman and Cyclops are solar-powered, so their abilities would recharge faster when outside and in daylight. The Hulk's strength is proportional to his anger, so he would get an energy boost every time he got hit. Iron Man would have to go and plug himself in (or get hit by an electrical attack) to recharge.
Similarly, there could be situations that would cause the character to lose all their powers and revert to standard human form temporarily; Krytonite for Superman, inhibitor collars for mutants, being away from Mjolnir for too long for Thor and so on.
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One thing that could make the 'energy' stat more interesting is if it were tied in thematically with the source of that character's powers.
For example: Superman and Cyclops are solar-powered, so their abilities would recharge faster when outside and in daylight. The Hulk's strength is proportional to his anger, so he would get an energy boost every time he got hit. Iron Man would have to go and plug himself in (or get hit by an electrical attack) to recharge.
Similarly, there could be situations that would cause the character to lose all their powers and revert to standard human form temporarily; Krytonite for Superman, inhibitor collars for mutants, being away from Mjolnir for too long for Thor and so on.
Oh yes. A 'solar buff' or whatever that ups energy recharge rate. You can make it generic. Like popeye would have a spinach buff...:-)
As for the achilles heal and weakness, that would be a mechanic put in later. Have to think on how to do that. Most SuperRPG's have some sort of thing like that though, so it should be doable.
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I've been kicking around something similar for quite a while too; here's kind of an info dump on what I've been thinking.
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This is all great stuff. I think the key is going to be the episodic system. It provides a certain limitation, without that the game becomes hard to develop. I think I'll go with a procedural city, but with the missions/episodes sort of starting when you discover the bad guy doing something bad.
I've given thought as well to just having an headquarters screen where you are given a list of missions to go on, ranked by how hard they are. Traveling too and from the location is not part of the game. In this way you can go to the moon, mars, space station, cave lair, etc...you aren't limited to Hero City or whatever. The benefit of having a city is that you can walk around patrolling trying to stop crimes...I think the mission based system is FAR more doable.
The reputation mechanic will come into play when you meet police or other government agents. They will help, hinder or just ignore you.
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@Wirehall - When I get something truly workable I'll post it. I think a truly workable RPG system transferrable to a roguelike is a major design hurdle. I'm currently working on a cohesive system of powers with DiabloIII's system in mind. But of course you don't have to pick a certain Archetype, you can build your own, but Archetypes will be available to choose so you can jump in quickly.
City of Heroes has great archetype examples. And yes, for flavor the 'energy' system can be anything from 'focus' to 'rage' to 'solar power' to 'chi' to 'baddassery' to 'spinach' etc...your 'origin' category can effect this.
An example of the system I am trying to create. The 'blast' or 'ranged' or 'shoot' power is going to be fairly common. Examples...
<Flavor Text> SHOOT (RANK, EFFECTS, DRAWBACK)
The flavor text can by like Eye Beam, Gun, Ninja Stars or whatever. SHOOT is the generic game mechanic. Rank will be the damage level of the power, 1 for a sling shot and 9 for a huge cannon.
EFFECTS are status effects. Like pushback, damage over time, freeze, stun, debuff etc...explosion on target might be an effect too for like grenades and fireballs and such.
Note the EFFECTS are sort of like the runes system in Diablo III, allowing you to mod each ability somewhat.
Other generic powers:
DEFENSE [for armor, dodge or whatever helps a character avoid damage, permanent or toggle]
MOVEMENT [flying, web slinging, long jumping can all be done generically as 'terrain ignore abilities']
FIGHT [Close combat ability, bump attack basically. Rank 9 for adamantium claws.]
BUFF [Temporary + defense, fight, etc...think Hulking up, etc...]
RESIST [ignore some type of damage or status effect, a high rank is nigh immune to a damage type]
STEALTH [pretty basic, it just applies the 'hidden' status on the player while active]
Of course there will be more rare and exotic ones, like Rogue's powers, but just those ones above you can make passable versions of many heroes. Then you can build from there.
Check out HiLo Heroes online, it does some good generic treatments and solid mechanics.
http://dreamsanddragons.blogspot.com/p/hilo-heroes.html
Also check out Heroes Unlimited for some great random origin/background/flavor tables. Truly a fine and under rated product. PM me if you want a copy of the PDF, but if I were you I'd totally just buy it, along with the second super powers book which has tons of other 'origins' like super soldier, eugenics, side kicks, etc...
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Also the Awesome Sauce RPG cannot be overlooked. :-)
http://trollhammerpress.blogspot.com/2012/02/other-p-rpgs-8-awesomesauce-roleplaying.html
It uses that 'action point' type mechanic, where on each adventure/mission/episode they can expend their points to do amazing things. This is also called 'edge' in some systems.
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Hey Wirehall, you might add a dodge mechanic that's actually a dodge. As in, your character will actually jump to the side? I've always wanted to see that, perhaps it breaks the RL type game a bit because it takes control of your character...but I like NOT being able to dodge in a narrow passageway, makes for a greater variety of tactics in a combat heavy genre.
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Hey Wirehall, you might add a dodge mechanic that's actually a dodge. As in, your character will actually jump to the side? I've always wanted to see that, perhaps it breaks the RL type game a bit because it takes control of your character...but I like NOT being able to dodge in a narrow passageway, makes for a greater variety of tactics in a combat heavy genre.
That'd make a great ability for a martial arts character. On a successful dodge, you get to choose an adjacent square to move into, which can be the attacker's square (but not any other character's). Other reactions could be a possibility too; counter striking, throws . . .
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Hey Wirehall, you might add a dodge mechanic that's actually a dodge. As in, your character will actually jump to the side? I've always wanted to see that, perhaps it breaks the RL type game a bit because it takes control of your character...but I like NOT being able to dodge in a narrow passageway, makes for a greater variety of tactics in a combat heavy genre.
Dwarf Fortress does this, but you can't control where you move. Once I was having a duel on top of a tower, and my character jumped over the edge to avoid an attack.
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Wirehall, any news or updates on your work on Rogue City Heroes?
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Has anyone started something like this? I've been looking for a small project to polish up my own roguelike framework and this seems like a fun project for it.
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Oh man dude, I'm not sure a super hero roguelike is a small project at all. The character building, all the different power effects and the underlying game system to support all of that is daunting. Just daunting.
I have been working on a game system that would work mechanically, but it's still very much on the drawing board.
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Has anyone started something like this? I've been looking for a small project to polish up my own roguelike framework and this seems like a fun project for it.
Even if someone else has started it, I would say that you should go for it. Statistically speaking, the chances of both you and the hypothetical competing developer both finishing such a game is pretty slim. Furthermore, the chances that both games are even remotely similar beyond the common thematic elements is pretty slim. So have fun and happy coding!
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Oh man dude, I'm not sure a super hero roguelike is a small project at all. The character building, all the different power effects and the underlying game system to support all of that is daunting. Just daunting.
I have been working on a game system that would work mechanically, but it's still very much on the drawing board.
Jo, Normally you're able to think of a reasonably simple system to capture an idea of this kind - what's stopping you in this case? What can you cut out?
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I think the issue here is that Comic Book Heroes really encompass all genres and themes at once. From Conan to Galactus.
So let's say you limit that to just street level Batman and Wolverine types. No intergalactic, but Hero City type stuff, Justice League maybe, Avengers, X-Men but not Guardians of the Galaxy.
Still, there's a HUGE variety of effects you must program. The simple system I've come up with would work, but it's a ton of engine level stuff, and very generic by necessity.
So now you have a second major issue. The fun of a Super Hero type game is the themes of the powers. Dr. Strange is a wizard, Iron Man has his suit, Cable is a cyborg, Wolverine is sort of of a cyborg but also a mutant. And it's not just the power origin but also the backstory that makes them interesting.
For example Deadpool and Wolverine have similar powers but are wildly different characters.
I've come up with the following generic system. You rate each hero not by descriptive stats but by mechanical stats.
Moves:
Hits/HP:
Bump:
Shoot:
Throw:
Stealth:
Special Effects (passive, toggle off/on and activation abilities)
Commands would be Move/Bump attack, ranged attack and pickup/throw object, toggle or activate an ability. Simple commands. Note that picking up and throwing stuff is essential when super strength and telekinesis are being considered.
Character building would be where the theme comes in. You would have a certain number of character slots or points. So to build wolverine you would choose.
-Human: Move + 3, HP + 3, Bump +1, Throw + 3, Stealth + 1
-Healing Passive: +1 'hits' each turn.
-Claws: +3 Bump stat.
-Reinforced Skeleton: +5 HP.
And so the game would represent this as these stats
Moves: 3 (human normal)
HP: 8 (3 human plus 5 for choosing the Reinforced Skeleton)
Bump: 4 (1 human + 3 for claws)
Shoot: 0
Throw: 3
Stealth: 1
S/FX: Healing (+1 hits per turn)
This is a very workable system, I envision it being a Turn Based system, like a squad based game or a single player RL with a sidekick (like the dog in nethack) is also a possibility. With the game flow being a 'choose your mission' type were you sit in your Hall of Justice and choose which crisis to go after or bad guy lair to invade. Or maybe you can 'Patrol' and walk around the city looking for baddies to defeat.
With this sort of system, and enough time spent on adding tons and tons of interesting character building choices, you can create a pretty solid Roguelike or Turn Based Squad game. For flavor you can roll up random backgrounds and motivations, the RPG Heroes Unlimited has TONS of these.
You can even create packages, semi randomize presets themed around an origin, so you can start the game quicker. For example:
Mutant Package
-Human plus 3 random powers from the 'mutant' group.
Martial Arts Package
-Human, Stealthy, +2 from Hand to Hand group and +1 Chi group.
Street Solider Package
-Human, Flak Vest, +3 random choices from Weapons Group.
It's not that I can't design it, it's that done right this sort of game can blow up huge. It's not a simple project.
Let's just say that my next 7DRL is going to be NOT THIS!!! ;)
EDIT: Punisher (Human, Body Armor, Guns, More Guns, Bad Attitude)
Moves: 3
Hits: 6 (+3 human, +3 armor)
Bump: 3 (+1 human 1, +2 bad attitude)
Shoot: 6
Throw: 3
Stealth: 1
S/FX: None
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Note the above system can be weak in modeling the Super Smart and/or Super Charismatic characters. Super Smart would probably have to be modeled by the stats that their super invention gives them, and Super Charismatic would have to be modeled by having tons of minions in their lair or having extra sidekicks or something.
There's also the Incredible Hulk issue. Where a person transforms into something else, werewolves have a similar issue. But you can just have a 'toggle' Special Effects ability that simply changes your character build (and thus your stats).
One very interesting take on the Incredible Hulk issue is the Marvel Lego game. The Hulk can smash everything in that game, but you can also transform into Bruce Banner who is good and building stuff. Both are equally useful. Pretty neat idea really.
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It's not that I can't design it, it's that done right this sort of game can blow up huge. It's not a simple project.
Why not start out with the most basic concepts and work your way towards more specific ones until you get bored or whatever?
Any project can can potentially blow up huge. There's no reason why this particular one must do so.
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Agreed Van. I have at least 4 prototypes of this system. This is kind of an 'opus' project for me, but I'm not as good at the big shit as the DF, URR, Cataclysm and DCSS guys are.
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How about you give us a prototype or 2 to test and say which one we like better?
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I'm not interested in critical feedback. This one would be for me.
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I think all the variations and effects and the AI to use them well is part of the fun and challenge. I've got some free programming time tonight - I'll be sure to share what I come up with.
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I had some time this weekend to get most of the basics started. Simple worldgen, a few traits to pick from, some user interface things, and one existing superhero: Zoidberg. The creatures just wander around randomly for now. I'm focusing on breadth instead of depth until I have the major parts done then I'll add more content. Once I have decent ai and a world you can interact with, it should start being fun.
SWF:
https://sites.google.com/site/trystansprojects/RogueHeroPlayground01.swf?attredirects=0&d=1 (https://sites.google.com/site/trystansprojects/RogueHeroPlayground01.swf?attredirects=0&d=1)
Code:
https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground (https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground)
It's written in Haxe so it can be compiled to run as a Flash app, or on Windows, Mac, or on a bunch of other things.
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Well crap maybe my webs are messed up but I couldn't download that. :-(
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I had some time this weekend to get most of the basics started. Simple worldgen, a few traits to pick from, some user interface things, and one existing superhero: Zoidberg. The creatures just wander around randomly for now. I'm focusing on breadth instead of depth until I have the major parts done then I'll add more content. Once I have decent ai and a world you can interact with, it should start being fun.
SWF:
https://sites.google.com/site/trystansprojects/RogueHeroPlayground01.swf?attredirects=0&d=1 (https://sites.google.com/site/trystansprojects/RogueHeroPlayground01.swf?attredirects=0&d=1)
Code:
https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground (https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground)
It's written in Haxe so it can be compiled to run as a Flash app, or on Windows, Mac, or on a bunch of other things.
Interesting. It doesn't quite fit on the screen on my laptop, though - I only get the top half of 'What is your name?' etc. and can't scroll down.
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It's 1280x720 with a 12x12 font. My previous RLs were criticized because they were a non-standard screen size and too small of a font.
Do you know what standard resolution would work well for you?
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Great concept with loads of promise, Jo. You have enough core concepts sufficiently sketched out to go to prototype. There you can road test the mechanics and think of new possibilities.
Absolutely do it for yourself, it's one of the best reasons to do anything. But don't you dare hide this away! I am already salivating to play this game. :D
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It's 1280x720 with a 12x12 font. My previous RLs were criticized because they were a non-standard screen size and too small of a font.
Do you know what standard resolution would work well for you?
My current screen res is 1366x768, but of course running in a browser you have to factor in the address bar et al which will intrude on that space. If you're planning on keeping it as a browser game then ideally you should make it adapt to whatever size window it's currently in.
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Great concept with loads of promise, Jo. You have enough core concepts sufficiently sketched out to go to prototype. There you can road test the mechanics and think of new possibilities.
Absolutely do it for yourself, it's one of the best reasons to do anything. But don't you dare hide this away! I am already salivating to play this game. :D
Don't get too excited. I'm better at Talkies than I am at follow through. :-)
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My current screen res is 1366x768, but of course running in a browser you have to factor in the address bar et al which will intrude on that space. If you're planning on keeping it as a browser game then ideally you should make it adapt to whatever size window it's currently in.
You should be able to download and run the swf on it's own. Maybe that requires the Flash standalone player, I don't know for sure.
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@Jo, what language do you use for RL development? I've been thinking about and prototyping some of these super powers and have come up with some ideas for how to easily implement them but I'm not sure what languages you're familiar with. Lua? GameMaker? Python? Something else?
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I've only been using GML (gamemaker language) for the last, well, forever. It's similar to Java, C++ and other high level languages. I can look at python and generally know what's going on.
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I can look at python and generally know what's going on.
Cool. My general idea is that a creature has a bunch of stats (health, str, etc) and a list of Traits. Each trait is an object with an apply method that takes a creature and changes it: increate a stat, decrease a stat, whatever. Each creature also tells their traits when things happen and traits can handle that however they want. So a trait can also effect the creature when something happens: gain health when the creature attacks another, reroll failed attacks, whatever. This covers a lot of cases and keeps the logic contained in each trait. I plan on adding more traits and mechanics like modal traits such as a sneak mode, run mode, or even shapeshifting.
My current project is written in Haxe - a cross platform language similar to Java and other static languages. You can see the traits that I have so far, and the screen where you choose one, at https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground/blob/master/Source/CreateCharacterScreen.hx
The creature class is at https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground/blob/master/Source/Creature.hx. The addTrait, on, and trigger methods are related to the traits and their effects.
Let me know if anyone has any thoughts.
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Sadist and masochist traits in a roguelike? Have you been playing IVAN?
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Sadist and masochist traits in a roguelike? Have you been playing IVAN?
I tried it years ago but didn't get far. Now that I think about it, I probably got the ideas from Cosmic Encounter - a board game from the 70s with aliens who have some really cool powers and names. The Sadist and Masochist both have their own extra victory conditions. The Sadist wins if all other players lose 8 of their 20 ships and the Masochist wins if they lose all 20 of their ships. Man that game is so much fun....
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I implemented a way to add custom actions (circle attack, power attack, extend claws, etc) to creatures since that seems like a cool thing to have.
Each creature also has a list of custom actions. Each action is a name and a function. The GUI lists each action's name and allows the player to call that function and eventually the enemy AI will know when and how to use them. Actions can be added as part of the default character setup, added by traits, items, chosen when leveling up, or whatever. I prototyped two: a Circle Attack that all heroes get and a Blink trait that just adds a Blink custom action.
See https://github.com/trystan/RogueHeroPlayground/blob/master/Source/CreateCharacterScreen.hx#L202 for the blink trait and custom action.
The latest build (which allows fullscreen when not run from the browser) is at https://sites.google.com/site/trystansprojects/RogueHeroPlayground02.swf
Any ideas for interesting attacks, other custom actions, or interesting mechanics?