Author Topic: Zelda roguelike  (Read 21021 times)

LazyCat

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #30 on: March 28, 2014, 04:14:57 PM »
Bomberman. Could Bomberman work as a roguelike? I submit that it would make more sense than Zelda.

I mean OP's question is just... good lord, are you people really willing to have a multi-paragraph, quote-and-response debate about this?

What? What are you trying to say? What are you complaining about? Do you even know?


mushroom patch

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #31 on: March 28, 2014, 04:17:38 PM »
Wow, this game is incredible. I was completely wrong to doubt this concept. It's even better than the original. It really connects with my love of turn based play.

In all honesty, I don't think there's any way to improve on your offering.
« Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 06:24:02 PM by mushroom patch »

LazyCat

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #32 on: March 28, 2014, 04:19:11 PM »
I think I do make a point. In a stackexchange site, this thread would've been closed in a matter of minutes for the lazy way in which the questions were posed, the general lack of merit in the idea behind the questions, and later the argumentative way in which answers were addressed. Constructive discussion occurs only accidentally in a thread like this.

It damages the focus of discussion forums to indulge nonsensical lines of conversation, especially ones like this where the only one who stands to learn anything from the discussion is the OP and he seems unwilling to take on board the points made by other posters.

Stop mumbling and go away if this topic is of no interest to you. Shooo-shooo!

mushroom patch

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #33 on: March 28, 2014, 06:15:58 PM »
It's too bad this project of yours is encumbered by copyright and licensing issues, because if you got this thing onto mobile phones, you'd be blowing up the app stores. I haven't felt this way since Flappy Bird.

Garadur

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #34 on: March 29, 2014, 08:38:53 AM »
Yeah, better than I expected. I still don't like it. Could be because I don't know Zelda 1 that well (and therefore suck at it), could be because the controls are not suited for a german qwertz keyboard (y and z are swapped). Could also be, that the emulator is so basic, that many of the graphics don't work properly.

Maybe it's better on a smartphone, I didn't try.
How do you use that emulator on a phone anyway? Does it only work on an iPhone? Does it work on Android? Do you have to jailbreak/root them?

At least I didn't play about equally bad in real time and "turn based". (I still wouldn't call it that)

I don't really like that the game continues for a second, until it finally stops, when you do nothing. Sure, that way you can block the shots of octorocs and the like, but it seems to be more complicated, han it needs to be.
I think it would be better, if it stopped immediately, or if it just stayed real time, like it was designed to.

As for the bet, I would call it a draw, until more people show me, that it's just my personal bias.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2014, 11:33:42 AM by Garadur »

LazyCat

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #35 on: March 29, 2014, 08:04:25 PM »
Yeah, better than I expected. I still don't like it. Could be because I don't know Zelda 1 that well (and therefore suck at it), could be because the controls are not suited for a german qwertz keyboard (y and z are swapped). Could also be, that the emulator is so basic, that many of the graphics don't work properly.

The important thing is the challenge is still there, it's playable. Surely there must be other roguelikes where characters could move in pixel size resolution grid instead of usual coarse grid with character sized cells?


Quote
Maybe it's better on a smartphone, I didn't try.
How do you use that emulator on a phone anyway? Does it only work on an iPhone? Does it work on Android? Do you have to jailbreak/root them?

I only tweaked that one NES emulator for PC, as a test. In the meantime I also found GBC emulator for Android (gbcoid) I am able to compile, but I am not sure if it's worth the trouble. Having to hold a key to navigate menus, pass through conversation screens and cut-scenes, while perhaps not too much inconvenient, it's just not good enough for overall game experience. Beside I'm not sure if I would be able to play background music while the rest of the game is paused, and if not, that would really make the game feel broken and likely be irritating.

It doesn't matter, it's still interesting example roguelike developers could possibly learn something from. If not from the gameplay, then at least how to manage inventory and different actions with only two buttons.


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At least I didn't play about equally bad in real time and "turn based". (I still wouldn't call it that)

Technically it is identical to classic roguelike simultaneous turn-based mechanics, only the grid is smaller (pixel size) and characters are bigger than a cell in that grid. This could be adjusted by increasing turn time interval thus making grid cells larger and turns more discrete. By making grid cells larger the game becomes harder, less action and more tactical.


Quote
I don't really like that the game continues for a second, until it finally stops, when you do nothing. Sure, that way you can block the shots of octorocs and the like, but it seems to be more complicated, han it needs to be.
I think it would be better, if it stopped immediately, or if it just stayed real time, like it was designed to.

I tried different things and at the end didn't quite implement it as I first suggested, it works more like Red Rogue does it. The difference is it continues to run for 15 frames, but AFTER you made your last input, to give monsters a little a bit of advantage in return for the pause. This roughly corresponds to disadvantage you would have in real-time due to reflex delay, it's a convenient way to directly impact the difficulty of this turn-based variant. While you are holding some key it actually plays normally in real-time, but note that even regular roguelike plays in real-time if you are holding a key.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2014, 09:27:03 PM by LazyCat »

LazyCat

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #36 on: March 29, 2014, 09:19:53 PM »
Would this qualify as entry for 7DRL challenge?

mushroom patch

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #37 on: March 30, 2014, 02:27:35 AM »
Would this qualify as entry for 7DRL challenge?

Absolutely. In fact, I'd say this should be the standard approach to making <your favorite 8-bit video game>RL. Just download LazyCat's emulator and pop in a rom. 7 day roguelike? More like 7 minute roguelike!

LazyCat

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #38 on: March 30, 2014, 04:56:34 AM »
Absolutely. In fact, I'd say this should be the standard approach to making <your favorite 8-bit video game>RL. Just download LazyCat's emulator and pop in a rom. 7 day roguelike? More like 7 minute roguelike!

Yes. I have to admit I was thinking of you when I posted that. What I was really meaning to ask is if I made myself something like that, from scratch, but with the same gameplay.

Now we are talking about labels and classifications, what is and what is not "roguelike". But I'm talking only about gameplay here, not about any Zelda game or anything else. It's simultaneous turn-based mechanics, so it would not disqualify a game from being a roguelike. Isn't that right?

guest509

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Re: Zelda roguelike
« Reply #39 on: March 30, 2014, 12:05:01 PM »
Right