Author Topic: My two cents about Permadeath  (Read 131063 times)

chooseusername

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 329
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #180 on: April 13, 2014, 06:08:15 AM »
You don't even understand what you said. Go ahead, describe how do you imagine memorization is going to help.

Not to add fuel to this retarded thread, but the ai in Pacman is entirely deterministic and based on your position. So it's possible to memorize paths through the maze that completely avoid them. Then play blindfolded. And win.
Can someone recap where this thread is up to?  I find it hard to work out what is going on from the last couple of pages.  What is actually being discussed here?

rust

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 70
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #181 on: April 13, 2014, 06:44:08 AM »
Can someone recap where this thread is up to?  I find it hard to work out what is going on from the last couple of pages.  What is actually being discussed here?

Some guy is defending save scumming, as far as I'm aware.



Now, LazyCat, excuse me for using your favorite line of argumentation, but it fits so well I just can't resist.

The way you phrased your unnecessary insult makes me think you have a small penis.

No, it's you who has a small penis. Admit it!

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #182 on: April 13, 2014, 07:38:42 AM »
It hit me this morning that when LazyCat says he beat Brogue without save scumming, it could be that he replayed the same seed (see the thread on random seeds) over and over until he won through memorization.

Like they say women remember everything.

chooseusername

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 329
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #183 on: April 13, 2014, 07:48:54 AM »
It hit me this morning that when LazyCat says he beat Brogue without save scumming, it could be that he replayed the same seed (see the thread on random seeds) over and over until he won through memorization.

Like they say women remember everything.
You're talking offensive nonsense again, take a pill :-)

guest509

  • Guest
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #184 on: April 13, 2014, 08:28:41 AM »
Decided to check out another long thread. Again another flame war.

Permadeath is important in certain game designs. Strategy, Arcade, Roguelike and Boardgames are permadeath genres. It works with those designs for various reasons. RPG, FPS, Adventure and other types of games generally are not good with permadeath, because seriously who wants to dive the Temple over and over (FF).

LazyCat

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 208
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #185 on: April 13, 2014, 11:36:03 AM »
Decided to check out another long thread. Again another flame war.

Permadeath is important in certain game designs. Strategy, Arcade, Roguelike and Boardgames are permadeath genres. It works with those designs for various reasons. RPG, FPS, Adventure and other types of games generally are not good with permadeath, because seriously who wants to dive the Temple over and over (FF).

What is the difference? Wherever I look I see it works the same for any game. For example you have Jagged Alliance normal and iron-man mode, some people save scum, some people don't save at all, and no one is complaining. Metal Gear games have their easy and extreme mode, and no one is complaining. For any game there are some freaks who play it with only one life or make speed runs without saving at all. It's not a matter of genre, but personal taste.

Endorya

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 513
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • The non-purist roguelike lover
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #186 on: April 13, 2014, 12:26:21 PM »
As the OP of this thread and feeling somewhat responsible for this ongoing war, I'm hereby requesting a moderator to lock it down. I've learned the lesson. Discussion saving-progress features in a roguelike forum is the same as discussing the human evolution at a creationism forum.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2014, 12:28:11 PM by Endorya »
"You are never alone. Death is always near watching you."

mushroom patch

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 554
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #187 on: April 13, 2014, 01:33:33 PM »
As the OP of this thread and feeling somewhat responsible for this ongoing war, I'm hereby requesting a moderator to lock it down. I've learned the lesson. Discussion saving-progress features in a roguelike forum is the same as discussing the human evolution at a creationism forum.

I don't think it's your fault. The problem is that we have a crazy person here who doesn't understand the difference between roguelikes and the legend of zelda. He sincerely believes that permadeath is nothing but repetitive tedium because the only real roguelike he's played (brogue) allows you to specify a random seed to replay the exact same game (not a traditional roguelike thing to do) and that's all he does. He therefore has a bizarre, passionately held opinions about permadeath (it's torture, you're just replaying the same "no skill," "easy difficulty" blah blah blah thing over and over). He's so traumatized by "beating" brogue replaying the same seed over and over (from the sound of it, he must have replayed that seed dozens of times, maybe into the hundreds).

Locking down this thread will make no difference. He'll bring his crazy into any even tangentially related thread.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2014, 02:25:29 PM by mushroom patch »

LazyCat

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 208
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #188 on: April 13, 2014, 03:54:22 PM »
I'm not playing the same seed over and over. No one does that, and it has nothing to do with save-scumming. How did you even come up with that... are you having a stroke?

mushroom patch

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 554
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #189 on: April 13, 2014, 04:23:42 PM »
Really? "Are you having a stroke?"

When a poster combines over-the-top, insulting and argumentative behavior with total lack of insight into anything (as far as I can tell) relevant to the forum's subject matter and incessant, obnoxiously frequent posting, there's really only one thing to do.

Endorya

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 513
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • The non-purist roguelike lover
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #190 on: April 13, 2014, 04:35:25 PM »
Come on guys... Let it go. Just drink the margaritas I ordered for you two and lets talk about women.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2014, 08:53:44 PM by Endorya »
"You are never alone. Death is always near watching you."

awake

  • Newcomer
  • Posts: 43
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #191 on: April 13, 2014, 06:29:04 PM »
Discussion saving-progress features in a roguelike forum is the same as discussing the human evolution at a creationism forum.
Or, ahem, vice versa ;)

Endorya

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 513
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • The non-purist roguelike lover
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #192 on: April 13, 2014, 07:56:08 PM »
Discussion saving-progress features in a roguelike forum is the same as discussing the human evolution at a creationism forum.
Or, ahem, vice versa ;)

Quite true.
"You are never alone. Death is always near watching you."

tuturto

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 259
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • pyherc
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #193 on: May 22, 2014, 05:13:09 PM »
The way you lack basic understanding of games makes me think two possibilities: you are either a troll or a woman.

I have an issue with this statement. Would you redact that? It's already hard enough for women to deal with all the crap that gets thrown at their direction in the industry. We don't need any of that in the forums.
Everyone you will ever meet knows something you don't.
 - Bill Nye

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: My two cents about Permadeath
« Reply #194 on: May 30, 2014, 09:30:28 AM »
It's already hard enough for women to deal with all the crap that gets thrown at their direction in the industry. We don't need any of that in the forums.

Yet you ask for more information from me. It's really difficult to answer shortly, but women don't get more crap than anyone else, they just start to scream if something happens. It's actually men that get more crap in reality, because in any workplace men are expected to do more and better than women. No one admits in out loud, but it's true. We don't critisize women like men, because it's now allowed. You are a bad person if you say something entirely true about women which makes them look worse than men in something. How long we will keep going on like this?