Poll

What do you feel about ToME's advertisements in the ROTY 2012 poll?

fair, every vote was deserved
18 (69.2%)
not fair, that was cheating
3 (11.5%)
I am not decided
1 (3.8%)
I don't care about this issue
4 (15.4%)

Total Members Voted: 25

Author Topic: ROTY advertisement fairness  (Read 33434 times)

Darren Grey

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2027
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • It is pitch black. You are likely to eat someone.
    • View Profile
    • Games of Grey
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #30 on: January 04, 2013, 09:17:53 AM »
I for one found it very entertaining seeing ToME and ADOM duke it out this year.  I encouraged it actually, in much the same way as I encouraged Dredmor vs ToME last year  ;)  And I look forward to seeing them fight again next year!  Along with any other rising competitors, of course - who would have guessed this time last year that ADOM would even be in the poll?  The poll will lose some of its excitement if it starts excluding the big games.  These big numbers drawn to the poll are all part of the fun.  If ToME had been excluded this year it would have been a boring easy win for ADOM.

Andrew: On that Roguelike Radio episode I pretty much said it would be a ToME/ADOM fight for the victory  :P

Musaab

  • Guest
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #31 on: January 04, 2013, 03:48:53 PM »
There's nothing wrong with asking your players to vote for your game.  No one is putting a gun to their head.  They might play your game, but still vote for another game.  Maybe they didn't even know about the poll until they saw the message. 

How many votes did the poll get in total (meaning how many people actually voted)?
Is that the number of people out there who play roguelikes?  Aren't there much more?

Ancient

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 453
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #32 on: January 05, 2013, 11:35:02 AM »
How many votes did the poll get in total (meaning how many people actually voted)?

It is there in the preamble to full results:
Quote from: Andrew Doull
Thanks to all 5,123 of you who voted on the 283 games below.
(emphasis mine)

Most certainly there are much more people who play roguelikes. Some could not be bothered to vote, some did not know about the poll.
Michał Bieliński, reviewer for Temple of the Roguelike

Fenrir

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 473
  • Karma: +1/-2
  • The Monstrous Wolf
    • View Profile
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2013, 03:07:22 AM »
I am often surprised by the silly arguments otherwise intelligent programmers have. Back to your labors! Make more free games for us muggles to enjoy.

Paul Jeffries

  • 7DRL Reviewer
  • Rogueliker
  • *
  • Posts: 257
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
    • Vitruality.com
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2013, 12:55:23 PM »
I have an enormous amount of respect for Andrew and the many many good things he does, plus it's his poll and he can put down whatever arbitrary restrictions he likes... but I think he's gone bat-shit loopy la-la over this.

The poll is not and never will be some kind of objective measure of quality - it's a measure of who can mobilise the biggest community.  A related measure, perhaps, but not the same thing.  I always assumed that was understood, and that it was just meant to be a bit of fun to get people talking and to expose people to roguelikes they might not otherwise try, and in that I think it does a good job*.  Furthermore, in that regard DarkGod advertising the poll in any way can only be a good thing.  Especially when the means he is using is specifically targeted to only reach those people who are actually playing the game.

The idea that huge numbers people actually give enough of a shit about winning that they will specifically alter their games to accomodate it (and as I understand it, TOME's in-game news system was pre-existing(?)) seems ludicrous to me.  And if they do - well, good luck to them.

I however also don't understand why DarkGod feels the need to continue to try to get the ToME community worked up about this poll. He's already won it twice. What does winning it again prove?

What, really?  You can't see that, perhaps having won it the past two years in a row actually puts more pressure on DarkGod to try to defend the title?  Winning might not prove anything, but losing might make it look as if the game had diminished somehow.

If you want the results to be more interesting and don't want TOME to keep winning every year, then just make a 'hall of fame' for games that have won three times in a row or something and exclude them from the voting.  Or, just exclude the previous year's winner (but let them compete again the next year) - that way you'll get some variety but still keep their communities interested.

*I think it would do a better one if all the games had links to their download locations, but I understand the massive amount more work this would require.

guest509

  • Guest
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #35 on: January 07, 2013, 04:22:36 AM »
I am often surprised by the silly arguments otherwise intelligent programmers have. Back to your labors! Make more free games for us muggles to enjoy.

WIN!

NeedsFoodBadly

  • Newcomer
  • Posts: 41
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
    • Amulet of Yendor
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #36 on: January 08, 2013, 01:01:10 AM »
I didn't even realize there were advertisements.

This year, I voted for ToME (because it's awesome), Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup and DoomRL.

It was interesting to see the massive resurgence in ADOM and it's definitely on my to-play list.
Amulet of Yendor: Roguelike news for Rogues by Rogues! | Roguelinks
Crapsoft Studios: "We keep the seat up!"

Slash

  • Creator of Roguetemple
  • Administrator
  • Rogueliker
  • *****
  • Posts: 1203
  • Karma: +4/-1
    • View Profile
    • Slashie.net
    • Email
Re: ROTY advertisement fairness
« Reply #37 on: January 09, 2013, 07:40:08 PM »
Coming late to this, but

I see nothing wrong on mobilizing your fanbase in favor of your game using whatever means you can... if tome keeps winning year after year it will only prove it remains the roguelike of the year, for having the most enthusiastic supporters and an active community. If Biskup is able to summon the hope of the people of Ancardia that believe on the future of his games, then those are the roguelikes of the year too, for so many people believe in them.

It will also encourage other game developers to seek the establishment of a community of players around their games, instead of polishing their "precious" in a dark cave for years and years.

Just a thought from a retired dev (or almost :P)

Edit: Also, if you want to check out the stability-breakers you can always look out for the "fight for the 4th position" or so, like those boring Formula 1 races
« Last Edit: January 09, 2013, 08:13:04 PM by Slash »