Author Topic: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them  (Read 5611 times)

RaustBD

  • Newcomer
  • Posts: 26
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« on: October 17, 2010, 01:24:07 PM »
Roguelikes are awesome games, but they're just so outlandishly inaccessible. But really, making them more accessible wouldn't require any dumbing down at all. It would really amount to just putting in a cheap tutorial that runs the player through the commands and when to use them.

Why do so few roguelikes have them?

Ancient

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 453
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2010, 02:39:58 PM »
As a roguelike developer tutorial level feels for me almost like wasted coding. After all if you can get a game by tutorial you could learn it through standard mode equally well. Turn based mechanics assure that you can access help anytime without hurry. I played tutorials for Xenocide, POWDER and Stone Soup out of curiosity but when picking new roguelike I prefer to take a glance at readme.txt. Takes less time while giving more information.
Michał Bieliński, reviewer for Temple of the Roguelike

Fenrir

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 473
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • The Monstrous Wolf
    • View Profile
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2010, 05:01:28 PM »
Like Ancient said, most roguelikes come with a list of keys, and you can usually get at it with '?'. I'd hardly call that "outlandishly inaccessible".

corremn

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 700
  • Karma: +0/-0
  • SewerJack Extraordinaire
    • View Profile
    • Demise RogueLike Games
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2010, 11:16:55 PM »
I am adding a tutorial to SewerJacks. I have a readme file, a hints file and online help via the '?' key, still people wonder why they die to a giant rat in the first level.  Some games need tutorials some dont.

The big RLs should have them, because they are the ones that new players will generally experience first. If people do not understand something they will move one quickly, leaving the world of roguelikes behind, and continue playing something like Icy Tower.  We need to capture the audience and hook them as quick as possible, a tutorial is just one answer.
corremn's Roguelikes. To admit defeat is to blaspheme against the Emperor.  Warhammer 40000 the Roguelike

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2010, 05:39:48 AM »
still people wonder why they die to a giant rat in the first level.

Usually first level enemies are easy and giant rats have been in that role always. When you change that people are going to think what is wrong.

Quote
We need to capture the audience and hook them as quick as possible

It's disappointing to die to a giant rat in the first level. It's not capturing.

Krice

  • (Banned)
  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 2316
  • Karma: +0/-2
    • View Profile
    • Email
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #5 on: October 18, 2010, 05:46:53 AM »
Like Ancient said, most roguelikes come with a list of keys, and you can usually get at it with '?'. I'd hardly call that "outlandishly inaccessible".

I think Dwarf Fortress has keyboard command list, but it was a game that I couldn't play, because I didn't know what the hell was going on. Of course, you can learn to play anything, but the user interface is an important factor in the playability of the game.

jim

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 380
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #6 on: October 18, 2010, 08:42:29 PM »
Agreed.

Alternately, someone could come up with a good "getting started" guide that at least explains the roguelike conceptually to folks who've never tried one. My girlfriend was totally bewildered for years at the "squiggle game" I played before I managed to sit her down and explained the interface for long enough to make her see how it all fit together as a game of imagination and strategy. Now she favors kobold assassins in Stone Soup.

Anyone know if a great example of that exists, actually?

RaustBD

  • Newcomer
  • Posts: 26
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2010, 02:25:37 PM »
ToME and CastlevaniaRL both have EXCELLENT tutorials, as do POWDER and Stone Soup. I found these a since posting this.

But it seems that the most complicated ones, with the largest amount of functions and systems, don't have a tutorial, and just expect you to read a manual. Dwarf Fortress, and games of similar intricacy, really should have a tutorial that actually physically walks you through the various important factors.

Vanguard

  • Rogueliker
  • ***
  • Posts: 1112
  • Karma: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Tutorials: More Roguelikes should have them
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2010, 09:32:58 PM »
Mage Guild has a nice tutorial too.