Temple of The Roguelike Forums
Game Discussion => Classic Roguelikes => Topic started by: hathat on February 13, 2016, 12:18:05 PM
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Hey guys,
If you've played the shell/command-line/console based unix Rogue a lot,
what would you guess is the maximum amount of the same kind of monster you have ever seen in one level?
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Maybe no one here has played the console unix Rogue, haha ;D
Let's expand the question to those who have played any version of Rogue then, console or graphical.
What's the maximum amount of any particular monster you have ever seen on the screen at the same time?
Thanks guys
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What's the maximum amount of any particular monster you have ever seen on the screen at the same time?
What kind of question is that? Do bots like to think stuff like that? Count numbers elsewhere.
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Hi Krice,
Thanks for replying. :)
I'm not quite sure what you are asking. I'm not a bot. And I'm not coding an automated Rogue-playing program, if that's what you meant.
Let me explain why I ask.
I heard about Rogue (and roguelikes) quite a few years ago, and have finally started playing it recently - command-line version 5.4.4 to be exact.
I like it a lot, and I had the idea to make a kinda table-top version to play with friends - and for that I'm trying to get an "appropriate" amount of suitable miniature figures. (think D&D or Warhammer figures)
Having looked through the source codes (or binary, in the case of MacRogue) I have the following monster lists, though I don't yet know which version I'd like to base the "boardgame" on:
ROGUE 3.5 ROGUE 5.4.4 EPYX 1985 GRAPHICAL MACROGUE
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giant ant rattlesnake rattlesnake
bat bat bat
centaur centaur centaur
dragon dragon dragon
floating eye ice monster ice monster
violet fungi venus flytrap venus flytrap
gnome - -
hobgoblin hobgoblin hobgoblin
invisible stalker phantom phantom
jackal emu emu
kobold kestrel kestral
leprechaun leprechaun leprechaun
mimic xeroc xeroc
nymph nymph nymph
orc orc orc
purple worm jabberwock jabberwock
quasit quagga quagga
rust monster aquator aquator
snake snake slime
troll troll troll
umber hulk medusa medusa
vampire vampire vampire
wraith wraith wraith
xorn black unicorn ur-vile
yeti yeti yeti
zombie zombie zombie
- griffin griffin
But reading the code, and trying to statistically infer how many monsters of a given type can reasonably be expected to occur on the screen (board) at the same time, is not a simple task. I assumed there would be players who have a lot more experience playing Rogue than I do, and for whom it would be easy to give a quick guess, whether the guess would be 3 or 5 or 10 or whatever. As I said I've only just gotten into Rogue, so I don't know what is statistically "common", to phrase it that way.
I'm a newbie in the Rogue world, sorry if I'm asking stupid questions.
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There are a few console players around here...
Three monsters of the same kind on one level is not uncommon. Five would be rare, I can't remember running into more than that. If you walk into a big treasure room you might find that many all on screen at once. 6 figures should be plenty for a board game.
I'd suggest not basing a board game too closely on the mechanics of Rogue. All the walking through corridors and resting to heal would get boring if done by a group of players throwing dice instead of being automated by the computer.
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Thanks a lot elwin, for the friendly reply :)
I think you're right about not modelling the mechanics too closely. As long as the feel and spirit of the game is right that should be fine.
Thanks for the tip!
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I like it a lot, and I had the idea to make a kinda table-top version to play with friends - and for that I'm trying to get an "appropriate" amount of suitable miniature figures.
Why can't you try what amount of monsters work the best? Why do you need to know how many there are in a computer game? It depends on what you are trying to do.
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True, I could try what amount works best. It's just that I'd like to make the experience as "authentically Rogue" as possible, while still making it playable of course. So for a start, I'll go with 5 or 6 miniatures of each kind. You know, if I'm gonna buy miniatures, I'd rather buy 5 or 6 at once, instead of having to go back and add later.
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True, I could try what amount works best. It's just that I'd like to make the experience as "authentically Rogue" as possible, while still making it playable of course. So for a start, I'll go with 5 or 6 miniatures of each kind. You know, if I'm gonna buy miniatures, I'd rather buy 5 or 6 at once, instead of having to go back and add later.
Don't worry about Krice. His obnoxious trolling is part of the scenery here after so long.
I think it's an interesting idea to try and recreate the Rogue experience, though I do agree with elwin (and, if you get past the hostility, Krice) that adapting Rogue as faithfully as possible wouldn't necessarily result in an enjoyable experience.
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Having looked through the source codes (or binary, in the case of MacRogue) I have the following monster lists, though I don't yet know which version I'd like to base the "boardgame" on
The difference between the earlier and later versions is due to the authors replacing D&D-specific monsters, presumably to avoid legal issues.
I'd suggest not basing a board game too closely on the mechanics of Rogue. All the walking through corridors and resting to heal would get boring if done by a group of players throwing dice instead of being automated by the computer.
I see Rogue as an attempt to mimic the experience of the kind of megadungeon-oriented, disposable character playstyle that's been promoted by the recent OSR movement. In the absence of a human GM, it's surprising that Rogue itself is so fun when it could easily have been tedious. Compare it with Dungeon Robber (http://blogofholding.com/dungeonrobber/index.php), a much less fair game that's essentially an automated implementation of the random dungeon generation tables in the back of the DMG (although I find the character retirement aspect of the game intriguing). I think the lesson is, as elwin says, to tailor the gameplay to the medium. Rogue was designed to be played on a computer, while the DMG tables were designed to be incorporated into a game with a human gamemaster interpreting the results. A rules-constrained wargame/boardgame is neither, so it needs its own design.
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how has it gone?
as to your original question, other than in treasure rooms it is
pretty rare to see a large number of figures on the screen at
one time. so my guess is that three of each would work. 3x26
is a large set! me being rather frugal would use old 1x1 tiles
with something painted on.
if you are having multiple players though, it would seem that
you would add more monsters to balance.