Temple of The Roguelike Forums
Announcements => Other Announcements => Topic started by: getter77 on May 30, 2009, 04:24:49 PM
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Distinguished folks of Roguetemple and random folks from elsewhere that eventually see this, I have an announcement to make. Of the many reasons I choose to make this here as opposed to the .Dev or .Misc Google Board, one of them is so this doesn’t get lost among spam for shoes and bags. There’s not been a post of this ilk on here before, or technically anywhere else on the internet that I know of, so I ask for some slack to be cut as is necessary and proper. That said:
My name is Brian Emre Jeffears. I enjoy videogames and Roguelikes in particular. I am 25 years old, single, childless, have no degree of higher education, unemployed, have a screwed up family/personal life, unusually disabled in a certain way, living at home, and owing to various other private medical circumstances in the background it would not be at all strange for me to shuffle off by the time I’m 30. Some of the folks here might be on enough in years or circumstances likewise to understand the concept of “Legacy” and what it can mean to a person---for those that don’t you will at some point down the line.
Remember how everybody thought the lads behind Dwarf Fortress were patently insane to chuck it all and expend themselves at their would-be Magnum Opus and count largely on the contributions of grateful players in a classical fashion? I surely do and nodded approvingly that such a plan of action has thus far proved viable for them.
However, what I have decided to do is quite different, yet much more insane, far reaching, and likely generally counterproductive to having a reasonable go at life in the grand scheme of things.
We’ve all seen many things happen in the Roguelike community and videogame industry over the years. For the many good things that have happened and exciting moments of progress, there have also been many things lost and obscured along the way as well as things that should’ve panned out but didn’t for one reason or another. As is often the case, we shrug our shoulders and are content to deal with that which did make it and just hope things work out in general otherwise somewhere down the line.
At this point in time though, I feel it to be a less than optimal use of my remaining time to continue to carry on as a benign spectator in the fine tradition of voyeurism.
Instead, with this serving as my official declaration of intent, I have come to the conclusion that the path now before me is one of direct participation and interaction within the world of videogames and Roguelikes proper---with a slant to the latter in particular.
“What in the world are you going on about? Just use the announcements section if you’ve got a game you are trying to cobble together or fish some team members for to be the next great or something!”
Indeed, if only that were the case here. I suspect I’d be on something akin to easy street if this was just a long preamble heading towards another Talkie info stub on the Roguebasin database. No, this is something entirely different that really has no precedent to work off of.
Relative to the Roguelike portion of what lies on my plate, what I aim to do is acquire the necessary skills to modernize things up and ultimately keep things lively---across the board. As opposed to a project or projects of my own, which would come much later I suspect, instead this is about settling things up from the past that have gone unsettled for far too long now.
Below you will find what I’ve come up with after digging through the entire Roguebasin database while specifically ignoring certain projects either due to lack of information to make a decision on them, lack of interest on my part, everything seemingly already being well in hand, or they being something to get into much later on account of one aspect of their existence or another. This list is meant to grow and shrink over time and as people can better inform me of projects out there and these in question. If you have some to mention, or can clarify on anything I’ve got a question mark on, please do so in this thread.
Current list of known applicable Roguelike projects:
Tiles Language
3059 Yes C++
Abura Tan No C++
Advanced Rogue No C
Alan’s Psychadelic Journey No C
AliensRL No Free Pascal
Artisan ? Python
Atinar Some ?
Avanor No C++, Lua
BOSS No Pascal
Beggar Yes? Java
Berserk! No? Free Pascal
Beyond Some ?
CalcRogue Yes C
Caravan No Reva
CastlevaniaRL Yes Java
Caverns of Underkeep Yes Java 1.5
Champion of the Savarian Empire No ?
Deliantra Yes/Some C++, Perl
Dimension Dungeon Yes Java
DoppeRogue No FreeBasic
Chronicles of Doryen N/A C++
Downfall No C++
dRogue No C, Scheme
DungeonMinder No C++
DungeonS No PAlib, C++
Dungeon Monkey Yes Free Pascal, JediSDL?
Egoboo 3Dyes C SDL/OpenGL
Elona Yes Hot Soup?, ?
Evolution No Free Pascal
Fourth Age ? Python
Frozen Depths No C++
G.O.R.E. No Vala?
Geminum Orbis No C++
GenRogue No FreePascal
Gruesome No FreePascal
Guild No ?
H-World Yes Lua, C++
Hokuto no Rogue Yes Java
I, Monster No Python
IVAN Yes C++
Ighalsk ? Python
Jaunt Trooper series Varies ?
Kaduria Yes C++
Reptoran Saga No C++
LambdaRogue Yes FreePascal
Larn No C
Legerdemain No Java
Lord of Rage and Death No ?
Mage Guild Yes C#
MetaCollider No Python
Nazghul Yes C++
Netchaos ? O’Caml
Omega No? C
Papaki No C++
Paprika Yes Visual Basic 6
Peleron’s Brilliant Rebith No C++
Prospector Yes FreeBasic
Pyro No Python
Scallywag: In the Lair of the Medusa Yes C++/Libs
S.C.O.U.R.G.E. Yes C++, OpenGL, Squirrel
Super Rogue No C
Star Rogue Yes Delphi
Valley of Neustria Kinda ?
T.o.M.E. Yes? C/Lua
TwilightMMORL No C
UltraRogue No C
Vampire Hunt No ?
Woods of Torbin Yes C++/Java
Xenocide No C++
XRogue No C
Total C: ~12
Total C#: ~2
Total C++: ~20
Total Java: ~6
Total Java 1.5: ~1
Total Python: ~6
Lua: ~3
Delphi: ~1
Squirrel: ~1
OpenGL: ~2
Libs: ~1
FreeBasic: ~2
Visual Basic 6: ~1
O’Caml: ~1
FreePascal: ~7
Hot Soup: ~1
SDL: ~1
JediSDL: ~1
PAlib: ~1
Scheme: ~1
Reva: ~1
The goal with each of these, as applicable unless they wind up taken off the list, is to get them graphical via tiles(there will be some cases where ASCII will also be needed as well I’m sure) or some such as appropriate, get them working properly, and to help them get effectively finished as can be reckoned---all at as ruthlessly efficient and quick a pace as can be figured out and implemented. This amounts to me going around raising the bar overall whilst raising the dead.
If you are, or part of, the original or ongoing force behind these games---expect to hear from me at some point unless you wind up contacting me first. The order of events in terms of stuff definitively starting and happening is still quite up in the air as you can see there’s a decent sized list above as well as the several programming related aspects that I’ll have to pick up on and gain competence at from scratch. From my prior posts, the sleuths among us will quickly realize 2 projects in particular that hold a high probability of being my first targets on account of buying them and such---but nothing is written in stone. Logic would seem to entail that the graphical aspect to all of this would happen faster than the programming aspect.
“This is completely impossible pie in the sky!”
It shouldn’t be completely impossible, though I forecast all to be difficult in their own ways as I come to grips with each one’s unique situation and at least one or so to be very difficult despite when it has come to pass that I’ve satisfactorily completed several other of the above listed.
“How do you avoid a common end like starving the death?”
Well, not unlike in the games, part of that comes down to random events I’ve no control over. Otherwise, an aim would be to break into the videogame industry via developing the necessary array of skills and a portfolio, testing, and so on. Ideally, I’d like to not be tied into any one company per se but rather able to assist as needed across the spectrum. I’ve already helped with closed testing for an upcoming PC Retail RPG, and hope it is not the last such instance. Failing the above, or perhaps ultimately anyhow, I’ll wind up going the one-man corp/small business route of digital distribution without DRM to get by as I don’t need vast wealth though it would be handy. I also see a void that could be filled in terms of a Roguelike Foundation of sorts, and such would be something for me to look into as the years roll on. Should random, “normal” work bits avail itself to me in my local area for a change, I’d likely take a crack at it if I can get it for useful bursts of cash for useful bits like development programs, hardware, food, etc along the way. Once I actually have accomplishments under my belt, I too would likely submit to a Donationware model not so unlike what the Dwarf Fortress lads are doing.
“Is there a website where you are going to centralize all of this?”
Eventually, there will have to be I reckon. For now, this thread will serve that purpose in terms of updates, answering any and all questions that I can comfortably, and so on as learning how to make a website is another of the skills that I need to pick up and train to competence. I am very much opposed to the “sporadic updates at random intervals of months and/or years” approach, so the instinctual drive is to post updates in this thread and such at a likely weekly rate or thereabouts. AIM and such will also probably enter into the equation on that so as to facilitate real time collaborations and whatnot.
Furthermore, and with the intent of getting things livelier within Roguetemple, this is not totally subject to my own arbitrary decisions and whims. Community feedback, discussion, lobbying, and so on are meant to be very much a part of this in terms of the order I work on this or that and at times the direction things will go when it comes to hard questions.
There are 1 to 3 conditions I do have for working on any given Roguelike project though:
-Properly in the credits/credited by name as to the contributions I’ll have made.
-(when possible) To literally put myself into the game in question in a certain capacity…
-(hopefully) Anybody else being worked with has enthusiasm to get things squared away.
From here on, I open up the floor to comments, questions, vitriol, and so forth. Thanks for reading, wish me success as luck tends to be something I don’t attract when actually playing.
Ongoing list of projects I've made some manner of difference in:
http://www.heroicfantasygames.com/index.htm
http://keye2.phk.at/
http://lambdarogue.net/
http://trianglewizard.webs.com/apps/blog/
http://javacrpg.sourceforge.net/
http://www.soldak.com/Dins-Curse/Overview.html
http://www.sumwars.org/
http://www.plos.isgreat.org/MainPage.html
http://te4.org/
http://www.classicgamesremade.com/
http://www.gaslampgames.com/
As of January 8, 2012
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In other words you want to develop an existing roguelike?
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In other words you want to develop an existing roguelike?
Most all of the 70 or so listed above, the active and the abandoned, and likely newer projects (plus ones that are applicable yet didn't happen to wind up on this list) as they come into being, yes. There are also Roguelike ideas of my own games, as are there other types of games, that I will endeavor to bring to life most likely at a later date. From my current perspective, until I can reliably be of potent help across a wide spectrum of projects in a variety of ways...any attempt to seriously make something complicated on my own would likely prove to be lacking due to inexperience.
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Most all of the 70 or so listed above
Please visit a doctor before it's too late.
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Good stuff mate, I wish you the best of luck!
And, being a CS student, I'll be here to try to answer any technical, programming questions you may have and generally help around in my free time (there isn't too much of it though, sorry!)!
I'd start out with a suggestion that you develop an initial framework for what you envisage as being the GUI and tile interfaces. I'd go for an external library in C++ or something. I believe you can then make some addons/modifications to this library so that you can use it projects made in other languages - I know that you can call C/C++ stuff from Python and lua, for example. Thus, the brunt of the work would already be done and not need to be altered, as long as it's generic enough!
Again, best of luck, and feel more than free to ask any technical questions you have :)
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Good stuff mate, I wish you the best of luck!
And, being a CS student, I'll be here to try to answer any technical, programming questions you may have and generally help around in my free time (there isn't too much of it though, sorry!)!
I'd start out with a suggestion that you develop an initial framework for what you envisage as being the GUI and tile interfaces. I'd go for an external library in C++ or something. I believe you can then make some addons/modifications to this library so that you can use it projects made in other languages - I know that you can call C/C++ stuff from Python and lua, for example. Thus, the brunt of the work would already be done and not need to be altered, as long as it's generic enough!
Again, best of luck, and feel more than free to ask any technical questions you have :)
Oh, I'll surely have many a technical question to ask along the way and won't be shy about it. There will be something of a generic element at play, but in general as with many other games it will often work out best to have unique assets for each game to fit in with the game's world, theme, and so on. A good and very capable friend of mine will be able to give me a crash course in person on the most fundamental of fundamentals when it comes to the programming side of things so that should help. I can envision a need will arise to cobble together some unique tools of my own should any not come up upon searching for them when said times should develop. I have the "advantage" of having about 60-70+ hours per week for the foreseeable future to throw at this with zeal, so that's gotta help. There are also some experiments I'll check to see if it can pan out for some things to be accomplished while I sleep---not until I've got a sufficient feel for program writing and manipulation though.
Krice: Well, the overall goal is that lot of it. Whether I get that many to completion is another matter entirely owing in large part to chance, thus, a good element for community interaction here at the forum is to put on the thinking caps and come up with a "best" order owing to there being no guarantees what is liable to happen down the line. For example, relevant to at least one member here, the obvious IVAN component would be to finally weave together the offshoots aside from fixing things up as best as can be wrangled.
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Well, as long as the library has the capabilities, you can change only the use you make of it: instead of loading a certain tileset, you load another, then maybe your play area is larger for one game than the other, etc etc :)
In my personal experience, it is much easier to maintain motivation if you're working on something of your own. If you are just changing others' code, or trying to integrate two large pieces of code, it might be rather hard to both actually do and maintain interest and enthusiasm.
I'll look forward to your advancements :)
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Well, as long as the library has the capabilities, you can change only the use you make of it: instead of loading a certain tileset, you load another, then maybe your play area is larger for one game than the other, etc etc :)
In my personal experience, it is much easier to maintain motivation if you're working on something of your own. If you are just changing others' code, or trying to integrate two large pieces of code, it might be rather hard to both actually do and maintain interest and enthusiasm.
I'll look forward to your advancements :)
In general I can see where you are coming from when it comes to one's own work versus others. Still, this is about settling things that've been brought up here and there for years now about "somebody" trying to finish up, come back to, fix, etc---something akin to situating a need because otherwise it is kinda ridiculous that it has gone undone for so long. Think of how long it has taken for say Temple of Elemental Evil on PC to get "playable" in these modern times because the Circle of 8 group reckoned it "should've been!" all along the way.
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-(when possible) To literally put myself into the game in question in a certain capacity…
I'm not sure what you mean by that one. Do you want a 'getter' player class or something? :P
In general though there have always been a lot more stuff needing developing than developers have time and inclination to develop. Even the biggest of the roguelikes (like Angband) have a bare few active developers. I don't know of any *band variant that is being actively developed by more than one person.
I'll be interested in hearing of your progress. Let us know when you've actually got replies from people on the list. ;D
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-(when possible) To literally put myself into the game in question in a certain capacity…
I'm not sure what you mean by that one. Do you want a 'getter' player class or something? :P
In general though there have always been a lot more stuff needing developing than developers have time and inclination to develop. Even the biggest of the roguelikes (like Angband) have a bare few active developers. I don't know of any *band variant that is being actively developed by more than one person.
I'll be interested in hearing of your progress. Let us know when you've actually got replies from people on the list. ;D
-Heh, something a bit more Legacy oriented. Ideally, make a sprite or whatever for myself, named after me, that would be randomly generated, randomly friendly or hostile to the player, and of a random class/build/skillset appropriate to whichever game world it'd be in. Even if Spoiled ahead of time, it'd be a mystery every time what overall effect I would have on the player's game.
That people tend to at least initially work on developing their own stuff is normal, but there's something to be said for knocking things out logically. Once things get done, they are pretty much done---we've only a very finite amount of Roguelikes that have come about over the years and are in a position to be worked upon in the grand scheme of things. Besides, also as logic holds, the more well wrought and realized different Roguelikes a player can come into contact with, so too does that broaden his or her own perspective when it comes to their own projects---raising the bar thus higher since they've already seen "X feature" done right and want to see if they can go past it from having seen it properly situated.
With respect to Angband, as I understand it, the base Angband is slowly but surely getting there in terms of cleaning it up and having it situated. Once it is situated, I would guess from there would be time for the variants to emerge again outside of something like T.o.M.E. I guess, which is why it is on my list ahead of time versus any other .Band. In general, the "big fish" Roguelikes won't see any interaction from me any time soon due to their complexity and usually having folks actively poking it with a stick and such. I'd love to see somebody else go ahead and do a part or all of any one thing on my list as that'd be one less thing to be concerned about. It is kinda bizarre overall that the only 2 "teams" I can think of off the top of my head are The Dev Group for Nethack and the Stone Soup Devs.
It'll be a little while at least before I begin contacting anybody since as of this moment in time none of the skills are cultivated to the point of or approaching potency. The focus of next week will probably be on the Art side of things, so depending on how I take to the various tutorials and whatnot along with a lack of interruption on time, perhaps somewhere in the week after next would see me contact a certain person's group to see about getting it Tiled up as that is the only thing it actually needs as far as I know.
I'd encourage everybody to check the Roguebasin Database and the Roguelike Graveyard(since somehow the latter has listings the former does not..) on any of the names above that seem unfamiliar as the results may very well surprise you.
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It is kinda bizarre overall that the only 2 "teams" I can think of off the top of my head are The Dev Group for Nethack and the Stone Soup Devs.
Although it is not very bizzare that both those games are very* popular.
* In roguelike terms.
It'll be a little while at least before I begin contacting anybody since as of this moment in time none of the skills are cultivated to the point of or approaching potency.
As one of those currently tinkering with roguelike code my personal opinion is that willingness to get stuck in is more important than skill level. We can hope that the latter will improve with time, while the former tends to disappear if anything ;-)
I'd encourage everybody to check the Roguebasin Database and the Roguelike Graveyard(since somehow the latter has listings the former does not..) on any of the names above that seem unfamiliar as the results may very well surprise you.
I think that some of the ones in the graveyard have no sourcecode available. You may also find getting in touch with the authors difficult.
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It is kinda bizarre overall that the only 2 "teams" I can think of off the top of my head are The Dev Group for Nethack and the Stone Soup Devs.
Although it is not very bizzare that both those games are very* popular.
* In roguelike terms.
It'll be a little while at least before I begin contacting anybody since as of this moment in time none of the skills are cultivated to the point of or approaching potency.
As one of those currently tinkering with roguelike code my personal opinion is that willingness to get stuck in is more important than skill level. We can hope that the latter will improve with time, while the former tends to disappear if anything ;-)
I'd encourage everybody to check the Roguebasin Database and the Roguelike Graveyard(since somehow the latter has listings the former does not..) on any of the names above that seem unfamiliar as the results may very well surprise you.
I think that some of the ones in the graveyard have no sourcecode available. You may also find getting in touch with the authors difficult.
-Well, when I say I'm starting from scratch on the lot of this...I mean REALLY from nothing. So, once "it" exists, and can trod along the path to competency...then yeah I'll dip my toe in the water.
-At least some of the ones have the source situated. In those situations where it has been abandoned and no source is available, well, I'll have another type of monster to contend with entirely. In a most shallow sense, it will entail another aspect of my Roguelike wranglings not mentioned above, which will be hacking 1-2 of the older console Roguelikes to be fully realized. With unfinished PC Roguelikes that have been abandoned, best I can hope to do is "finish" them featurewise by taking the elements and such already there as a base that intrigued me in the first place and take them to their logical conclusions and make up as little as possible along the way. In a foreseen extreme case, I'll have to either reverse engineer the games(yikes) or recreate them feature for feature as best as possible from scratch as a clone. The latter extreme situation, most likely, will manifest in the full scope of what I'm hoping to get situated with the Jaunt Trooper series as mentioned in my other posts---especially if somebody can find me the 3rd game in the series and a way to run it and such.
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I had a glance through your list.
[b]Advanced Rogue[/b] Yes CWhat's to do?
[b]Caverns of Underkeep[/b] Yes Java 1.5The author is working on his next project, so may not be very interested.
[b]dRogue[/b] No C, SchemeI hope your Polish is good. ;-)
[b]Elona[/b] Yes Hot Soup?, ?I believe this is closed source and being actively updated by its (Japanese) author.
[b]Super Rogue[/b] No CHow many versions of Rogue do we need?
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I guess I'm somewhat unclear as to why some of those items are on your list. I get what you're going for, for ones that have been abandoned, but several of them (including my own) are under active development by a committed developer. In those cases...what, exactly, are you proposing to do?
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I had a glance through your list.
[b]Advanced Rogue[/b] Yes CWhat's to do?
[b]Caverns of Underkeep[/b] Yes Java 1.5The author is working on his next project, so may not be very interested.
[b]dRogue[/b] No C, SchemeI hope your Polish is good. ;-)
[b]Elona[/b] Yes Hot Soup?, ?I believe this is closed source and being actively updated by its (Japanese) author.
[b]Super Rogue[/b] No CHow many versions of Rogue do we need?
In order:
-Looks like an error! Good eye. Not seeing anything other than ASCII. This one, X Rogue, and Super Rogue stemmed from JHarris article on them and that they, if I read correctly have stability issues at the very least on top of lack of Tiles. Being some of the oldest of the old, and very nearly something that already vanished into the ether prior to the Roguelike restoration project---I reckon they might as well be as shined up and in order as they can be. For History!~ For at least some of them, at some kinda pace to my reckoning, they've got maintainers of some configuration---so any role I might ultimately have would be as another helper down the line(save the Tiles part as I've seen nothing to indicate anybody working on it overtly...).
-For Elona I recall various bits of "moving on" not long ago complete with a release of such full and proper for people to take it where they do. I do believe some people have already started on working on replacement Tiles to some degree stemming from, I think, "borrows" from older commerical games. See how the situation develops.
-With any foreign language issues, it'll largely be seeing what happens when the time comes. Should it prove a barrier and the original folk impossible to sort...well...it'll fall under the auspices of the above mentioned needing of "clones" and other complicated measures at least as complicated as coming up with the entire game from scratch. Best hope is for talented folk to return at last to their promising projects.
-With the likes of Underkeep, MageGuild(so awesome...), etc the notion isn't so much of an "immediacy" as it is a frame of reference and something to keep in mind down the line even to just the extent of being another helping hand, intentional tester, and so forth. The variety of programming languages and such and how they tally up amongst each other is of some interest in terms of how to weigh intentions of the order of events alongside how much is actually "needed" for the lot of it. The list will surely shrink and grow tremendously as things happen and I have a better picture of the flow of events and what aptitudes I'll be able to cultivate in due turn.
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Erm ok.
Looks like i am on the same page with Nahjor here.
I am uncertain what exactly you want to do with my poor little prospector (Who, i hope, has never done anything to you and right now huddles in a corner scared)
playtesting? go ahead, grab it, and tell me what you hate about it.
tiles? ... well it does have tiles (as of today), and i drew them myself, and it really really shows. If you want to improve on those i'd be delighted, and of course give you credit.
help programming? trust me, you don't want to. It's a barely readable hack from line 1 to the end. (also can't really see how that could work to be honest)
Or do you want to do something entirely different?
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Erm ok.
Looks like i am on the same page with Nahjor here.
I am uncertain what exactly you want to do with my poor little prospector (Who, i hope, has never done anything to you and right now huddles in a corner scared)
playtesting? go ahead, grab it, and tell me what you hate about it.
tiles? ... well it does have tiles (as of today), and i drew them myself, and it really really shows. If you want to improve on those i'd be delighted, and of course give you credit.
help programming? trust me, you don't want to. It's a barely readable hack from line 1 to the end. (also can't really see how that could work to be honest)
Or do you want to do something entirely different?
Woo hoo! How in the world did I miss that Prospector got Tiled? I'll update that part! :D
As to any specifics, again, yours counts as one viewed in general terms down the line. Perhaps I can eventually find and help document some bugs, or come up with some nifty something AND be able to put forth how it might go code wise as opposed to just the nifty notion outright...all just depends on how things shake out as time rolls on. Otherwise, being able to decipher, even partially, bits(blobs?) of hacked up coding would probably be a good thing that could come in handy down the line with other projects and such. Greater the variety of things I can come to understand and be exposed to in terms of the different languages probably the better I'll be for it. I forget where I heard it, but something to the tune of: "No matter how horribly you think you've written something yet it somehow works, there's always somebody who rigged it together even worse and is an even bigger miracle it runs likewise."
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Well, they have been there for less than a day and are really, really tiny, so it doesn't suprise that you didn't see them :)
gotta confess still not sure what you want to do though... rennaissance? This thing is 3 months old. the romans are still trying to figure out on what hill they should build.
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Well, they have been there for less than a day and are really, really tiny, so it doesn't suprise that you didn't see them :)
gotta confess still not sure what you want to do though... rennaissance? This thing is 3 months old. the romans are still trying to figure out on what hill they should build.
The goal is to spur progress and awareness in terms of having a greater body of realized works for people to get into and enjoy. To get things as lively as they can be/should be in the grand scheme of things considering how utterly fantastic the Roguelike notions of things can be yet have been largely ignored and squared away in deep niche territory all these years despite being one of the most venerable old times in videogame history. Plenty of folks find one game randomly that came out years ago and think, "Oh cool, there's something like this now!" I'd like more folks to discover many games and think "Wow, there's lots of good stuff now!"
In terms of the hopeful industry angle, the perspective I would hope to bring to various other games and genres would be one of not neglecting to look at some of the Roguelike hallmarks when hashing it all out---a champion of what they can bring to the table of sorts. Look at what the FPS advocates have accomplished over the years in terms of building presence! :D
On my reasoning, the marginalization of Roguelikes is just something that shouldn't be period.
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On my reasoning, the marginalization of Roguelikes is just something that shouldn't be period.
If I was you I'd drop every game that has been updated within one year from your list. Conveniently I have a list of Recently updated roguelikes (http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=Recently_Updated_Roguelikes) ;D
If you also drop all those that aren't open source and all those that already have tiles you should have a much more manageable list to work with.
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Okay ... after reading all posts I am still not sure what you want to do. I assume helping people in finishing development of their roguelikes?
Besides the fact that most roguelikes are never "finished", you can help me with LambdaRogue in the following ways:
- create a series of quests that fit the existing game and its in-game history (I would even wait with releasing 1.5 until you'd be finished)
- proof-read and correct all the texts
- create better sound effects than I currently have
You can do any point from this list ... just drop a mail.
Mario Donick
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On my reasoning, the marginalization of Roguelikes is just something that shouldn't be period.
If I was you I'd drop every game that has been updated within one year from your list. Conveniently I have a list of Recently updated roguelikes (http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=Recently_Updated_Roguelikes) ;D
If you also drop all those that aren't open source and all those that already have tiles you should have a much more manageable list to work with.
Remember: the list is meant to be far-reaching in terms of time AND what actually needs figuring. I hope nothing amiss happens with any of the recently developed Roguelikes as that'd be a downer, but should things go astray somehow or another during the next couple-several years, I won't have to rely on a fuzzy memory as it'll be listed as something to keep tabs on/keep in mind down the line. Some of the ones I list with Tiles either only have some, or they need help in some other aspect like the stability, realization of the planned feature set, and so on. Since efficiency is king along this thing by and large in my mind, the more complicated/time consuming what a game "needs" constitutes, the later it'll be that I'll get around to it and even within that there's bound to be a "best" or at least most logical order to tackle things. It took a good many hours in the database and some wavering to get the list as it currently is.
Mario: In large part, yes, the goal is to get as many Roguelikes better situated as is possible that either interest me personally and/or I can see the utility value in doing so across the spectrum of ideas and concepts in general. "Finished" in my mind only amounts to:
1. (Probably) Tiled or some other graphical interface. Surely, there will be exceptions where it just won't work.
2. Stable in terms of nothing going horribly wrong like bad memory leaks, crashing, etc.
3. Working as intended in terms of bugs, balance to some degree, and so on. Nothing will ever round out totally perfect, so there's no sense in worrying about it. Overall, for the experience the players have to follow logical intentions based on the gameworld's setup.
Bonus(But effort hopefully made..): Available! Be fantastic if the project in question could work on the Big 3 OS wise and anything else applicable so as to help engender digital immortality for it.
4. Known! I strongly believe there isn't some "rule" to where only a few Roguelikes can have visible discussions across the internet and in general consideration for what they are and accomplish as a game at large. With the above 3 conditions roughly met, there's nothing to say it shouldn't be sought for the game to be an Evergreen in terms of people being aware and enjoying it for a long time to come as opposed to something that appeared briefly and did cool stuff then vanished along with all that hard work and cool stuff. I don't want what has happened to the likes of the Jaunt Trooper series to happen ever again going forward if I can come to affect the outcome as it amounts to a cultural loss.
-As to your LambdaRogue bits:
-I'm not fit for #1 on account of not having played the game anywhere near enough to wrangle such a thing, nor completed enough of it. At this stage, my time for actually "playing" games and Roguelikes in general is intentionally tremendously limited on account of now being the time for me to develop the technical and artistic skills to be able to ultimately help out in more substantial ways---can't put off the pursuit of knowledge as this junction. The exception to the last game I played while getting all my affairs in order was that it was a nominally paying job closed beta testing that upcoming PC Retail RPG as it falls under the umbrella of my industry aspirations/not starving to death clause. So, surely don't wait for 1.5 on my account with this as there must be other more qualified folk to help out.
-#3 I've yet to come to grips with anything on the audio side of things, again, in terms of programming, art, music, sound---all of these are starting at zero for me with no prior experience whatsoever. The list largely reflects aspirations of skills and the levels I aim to reach at them as quickly as possible. I spent the outstanding majority of yesterday wringing my hands in rage at the fact that GIMP doesn't want to display at all correctly to where I can follow along with the user manual and tutorials on my current PC and nothing I could find FAQ wise or even anybody at an online chat at an enthusiast site has a solution. Plus it seems there might be an issue with getting FLoops to work on this PC as well but I'll look into that today. In general, if you've got tool and program suggestions then by all means since I don't want to be stuck completely while one or more things are acting up upon trying to come to grips in the first place...
-#2 I'm not an English Major by any means, but if there's a need for another pair of eyes on it then I could take a crack at it in short order and offer my possibly correct thoughts as I'm a fast reader. If there's some way you could just send me all the text in the game as it now stands in some kinda intelligible blob that'd be something I could pitch in with immediately. I'll shoot you an email now so that you'd have mine to send this to. Thanks in advance for a chance to help out a bit.
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Thanks in advance for a chance to help out a bit.
Well if you're up for a bit of C++ debugging I could really do with some help working out what I broke in the *_info / *.raw initialization process (http://sourceforge.jp/ticket/browse.php?group_id=4372&tid=17006) in JBand (http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=JBand).
I'm currently trying to "sneak round" the problem by working with SQLite in order to bypass the whole mess. ::)
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Thanks in advance for a chance to help out a bit.
Well if you're up for a bit of C++ debugging I could really do with some help working out what I broke in the *_info / *.raw initialization process (http://sourceforge.jp/ticket/browse.php?group_id=4372&tid=17006) in JBand (http://roguebasin.roguelikedevelopment.org/index.php?title=JBand).
I'm currently trying to "sneak round" the problem by working with SQLite in order to bypass the whole mess. ::)
Well, in theory, and I really hope this isn't the case, if you remain stuck on this issue for the X amount of days/weeks/months to come to where my friend can make it over(I'm hoping the process will begin sometime this week, but it could just as easily be next week...) and begin crash coursing me in C++ and the like in general programming....then surely at a time where I've some C++ understandings I'd be glad to help out. Definitely hoping you manage to find outstanding success in solving this and such LONG before then though. ;)
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-I'm not fit for #1 on account of not having played the game anywhere near enough to wrangle such a thing, nor completed enough of it.
Oh, this wouldn't be the problem as I would brief you with everything you needed to know ;)
But I'm fine with this, too:
I'm not an English Major by any means, but if there's a need for another pair of eyes on it then I could take a crack at it in short order and offer my possibly correct thoughts as I'm a fast reader. If there's some way you could just send me all the text in the game as it now stands in some kinda intelligible blob that'd be something I could pitch in with immediately.
I got your mail, you'll get one soon.
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-I'm not fit for #1 on account of not having played the game anywhere near enough to wrangle such a thing, nor completed enough of it.
Oh, this wouldn't be the problem as I would brief you with everything you needed to know ;)
Well, then perhaps we'll see then. I did manage to come up with some nifty things that should make it into the final build of that upcoming PC RPG...so I'm not averse to helping out with this, or at least being one of the ones helping out, either if you are sure about it. Timely progress is timely progress.
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It is late and my eyes itch a bit, but I will reply :P
I am not sure I understand your health issues (?) but I hope you make the best use of your time, which may not be devoting yourself 100% to this time comsumpting project.
On the other hand, I understand your desire to leave a legacy, and I appreciate your offer to the roguelike community. I'd recommend spending half your spare time in this, and look for another way to spend the rest of time (This will be useful when you look back in some years, we human are never happy with the way we invested our time).
I see one of your goals is to add tiles into the games if possible; while I understand this would lift the barrier of usability and make them accesible for a much wider audience, I see one way you could cooperate and propel forward the development of the game in a much more direct and strong way:
1. Provide excessive feedback to the developers of the games
2. "Market" the games around the web (I think you already proposed that)
(see, you don't even need to know how to program :) )
I am not sure you are aware of what it means to hack thru the source code of a lone, overnights-coding developer which codes for fun and not always for standards, mantainability or readability. It is not fun and it is not very rewarding.
I see a more powerful interaction would be becoming a "nuissance" (:P) to each and every developer in their forums, spam their emails with feedback about their projects. Raise their willpower so their projects leave that mediocre half finished status (http://slashie.net), and become decent games.
What do you think?
(And yes, CvRL needs you :))
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It is late and my eyes itch a bit, but I will reply :P
I am not sure I understand your health issues (?) but I hope you make the best use of your time, which may not be devoting yourself 100% to this time comsumpting project.
On the other hand, I understand your desire to leave a legacy, and I appreciate your offer to the roguelike community. I'd recommend spending half your spare time in this, and look for another way to spend the rest of time (This will be useful when you look back in some years, we human are never happy with the way we invested our time).
I see one of your goals is to add tiles into the games if possible; while I understand this would lift the barrier of usability and make them accesible for a much wider audience, I see one way you could cooperate and propel forward the development of the game in a much more direct and strong way:
1. Provide excessive feedback to the developers of the games
2. "Market" the games around the web (I think you already proposed that)
(see, you don't even need to know how to program :) )
I am not sure you are aware of what it means to hack thru the source code of a lone, overnights-coding developer which codes for fun and not always for standards, mantainability or readability. It is not fun and it is not very rewarding.
I see a more powerful interaction would be becoming a "nuissance" (:P) to each and every developer in their forums, spam their emails with feedback about their projects. Raise their willpower so their projects leave that mediocre half finished status (http://slashie.net), and become decent games.
What do you think?
(And yes, CvRL needs you :))
Thanks Slash, look after your eyes! :D
-While it may seem time consuming, because it is, that is because this learning phase is the trickiest one. I still do other things in the day, and once this "rough start" phase is cleared, I should then be able to actually DO things with less of a time investment by far than was needed to come to understand it in the first place. As I am rather boxed in at the moment and for the next foreseeable while, I reckoned to make the best of it as opposed to staying stuck in the same situation and never changing, or worse, stagnating.
-Remember: The Roguelikes are only part of the focus as I enjoy them so much. The hopeful career plan is game making and perhaps going as an indie if I can't manage to break into the industry and inject some fresh ideas from a different perspective. In any case though, what is needed are skills relative to game making. Once you learn those skills, one needs to practice and sharpen them so as to do work of increasing quality. "Oh, what have we here? Lots of projects with which to sharpen skills at programming, art, and music somewhat?"
Thus, the Roguelikes have a dual purpose aside from my inclination towards them---exercise AND portfolio material. Gain skills>>>gain job in relevant field>>>enjoy passionate work within my interests for as long as I can.
-With the more crazy coding parts, step one is to see if I even get there in terms of working on the easier projects first. The other part of the graphics equation, well, as is the funny legend around here---I simply can't play/comprehend any ASCII game outside of Triangle Wizard for some reason. Thus, for me to become a nuissance, I'd first need to be able to play the game...and there's surely some good ones I anticipate on that front.
-I do agree that frequent playing would be quite handy in many cases, as it is also something that needs doing. I have one day a week alotted for playing games so as to not forget the fun, though this is all games including Roguelikes and I have a large backlog of titles. Yet again, once I am capable of making progress past the learning stage, I surely want to get in more gameplay time.
One thing I plan to do somewhere in all this, and I encourage other people to do it as well(perhaps some collaboration is in order when the time comes) is to learn how to use the capture programs and have a substantial run at putting up Let's Roguelike and such videos on youtube for a large variety of games...perhaps with a weekly and/or monthly themed game of rotation. The POWDER Let's Play was a great start and surely similar things could be attempted.
For today, I will take a break from being smacked around by programs like Blender which has been a daily thing since Sunday, watch some anime, and dive into LambdaRogue's texts.
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Good progress on LambdaRogue helping when I finally got around to it in the latter part of today. Just the "book" folder remains and I doubt it will take very long.
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Heh heh heh...remember how I mentioned odd things can happen?
http://groups.google.com/group/rec.games.roguelike.development/browse_thread/thread/91191d0b1db825b0#
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Right, LambdaRogue edit completed and unless something went wrong with the email or the Zip file(fun fact: First time I actually put anything together in a Zip file somehow despite all these years...) it should be arriving in the inbox any time now.
Yay...first accomplishment since throwing down the gauntlet! :D
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Thanks for the quick work. The texts now read better than before :)
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You are very welcome. Here's to your project continuing to make progress of any manner of form. Cheers! 8)
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Some people say there's no such things as coincidences ;)
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I have always said the each roguelike needs a champion, someone to promote and provide feedback as much as you can. I urge all players to take getters lead and start hasselling you favourite roguelikes' devs as much as possible.
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Been a rotten weekend what with my Wii dying on me after nearly being a year old despite due to former terrible job and such I'd not even been able to put a dozen hours into it despite a stack of games. Warranty to the rescue but it still sucked the juice out. As such, plan is to dig in deep this coming couple weeks trying to wrangle programs not wanting to work and get a bead on something substantial within any of them. Crash course in programming has been delayed by...2-3+ weeks as the key educator is otherwise occupied helping out with a summer camp.
If anybody has ANY project related tasks that don't require programming, art, music---please do mention them as Mario did ala LambdaRogue as I'm somewhat fiending to accomplish something(s) as in keeping with my workaholic nature. (Which works so well for the unemployed, lemme tell ya). It was a good feeling working on/completing that bit for LambdaRogue...pretty sure I can/will come to see that as a kind of subsistence.
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You can draw/paint getter77?
Feel free to make the tiles of prospector recognizable! (I have cleverly hidden them in the file "tiles.bmp") (Messing with the palette is forbidden though)
Also if you tried the current version you will have seen a "colored space=pixel" graphic of a spiral nebula as the titel screen background.
I wouldn't mind having some more in that style for certain points, but my artist talents are to nonexistant for that.
The points where they could be are:
Ship selection (A hangar with the availiable ships)
Death (Awayteam getting eaten on some planet)
Victory ... dunno, suprise me (Player in his villa enjoying his riches perhaps?)
And maybe a background for space station interior
The specs might be a challenge: 80x25 pixel, 16 colors. (60x20 for the station)
If you would like to do any of the above and can i'd be delighted!
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You can draw/paint getter77?
Feel free to make the tiles of prospector recognizable! (I have cleverly hidden them in the file "tiles.bmp") (Messing with the palette is forbidden though)
Also if you tried the current version you will have seen a "colored space=pixel" graphic of a spiral nebula as the titel screen background.
I wouldn't mind having some more in that style for certain points, but my artist talents are to nonexistant for that.
The points where they could be are:
Ship selection (A hangar with the availiable ships)
Death (Awayteam getting eaten on some planet)
Victory ... dunno, suprise me (Player in his villa enjoying his riches perhaps?)
And maybe a background for space station interior
The specs might be a challenge: 80x25 pixel, 16 colors. (60x20 for the station)
If you would like to do any of the above and can i'd be delighted!
Unfortunately, I can't YET draw/paint on account of programs acting up on me and/or not having grasped how to use them with any kinda decent effect quite yet. :'( Thus, I'll have to defer this task or at least until some random later time when the above issues are solved.
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Oh. sorry misread that one. my bad.
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I'm not too fond of GIMP. There's a ton more stuff out there on Photoshop (learning material and so forth), which seems to be by far the industry standard. I'd suggest you go for that. Besides, for tiles you can probably use mspaint too, provided they're not too big or detailed ;)
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I'm not too fond of GIMP. There's a ton more stuff out there on Photoshop (learning material and so forth), which seems to be by far the industry standard. I'd suggest you go for that. Besides, for tiles you can probably use mspaint too, provided they're not too big or detailed ;)
For now at least, GIMP may well be too advanced for what I need it for, on top of not wanting to work right. There's a few other various programs I've dug up from corners of the internet...between all of them and mspaint surely I can get a handle somewhat with enough hours thrown at it. I'll try to stick to the free programs and such by and large for monetary reasons, though there may come a time where I'll have to throw some cash at one program or another out of necessity.
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I'll try to stick to the free programs and such by and large for monetary reasons, though there may come a time where I'll have to throw some cash at one program or another out of necessity.
Try PaintShopPro or something on 30 day trial. That should get you 30 days of tile editing anyway. ;D
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For pure tile editing, I use Tile Studio (http://tilestudio.sourceforge.net/) I'll be the first one to admit it's got some quirks, sometimes some pretty big ones, but it's got some major advantages over Photoshop or GIMP for tile editing due to the fact that it isolates the tiles into separate "images" for you to edit.
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Not sure about photoshop and gimp, but paintshop can do that too (and more importantly not do it, if you don't want it to)
While we are (more or less) at it: can anybody recommend a good (preferrably free) palette editor?
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This week in progress: None of the good stuff as it was pretty well totally derailed by family issues. :( On the flip side, for the first time in quite a long time, I did wind up actually playing some games again in the grand scheme of things---which now leaves me with some idea fodder in the realm of things to make sure never to do with any game I try to make in the future when it comes to bad design.
Hopefully the creative juices flow again sometime soon on the latest LambdaRogue bit, though I wonder if Mario got my last email asking for clarification on it prior to my week grinding to a halt?
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DoppeRogue isn't quite dead yet :P
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DoppeRogue isn't quite dead yet :P
Yeah, I saw that you dropped by RogueBasin and updated the page link.
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Yeah, I've been away from the project for a while, but it's one of the few projects I've started that I actually feel is worth finishing. Right now I'm working on a better random dungeon-generator....we'll see.
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Hurray! 8)
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Right, I've been in bad shape these past few weeks on account of my...less than stellar family situations. Granted, that is still ongoing, but suddenly as of now, and hopefully useful to blur this funk, the first bit of my crash course in programming is set to finally begin within the next half hour or so and last a presently unknown amount of hours heading into the rest of today.
Here's hoping folks.
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Good luck there!
Did it go well?
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Well, about 4 hours later and lots of yelling at the machine on both counts(since he hasn't programmed in many years) and I kinda got Hello World and something resembling a basic Adding Machine program going in C++ Visual 2008.
Not sure when the next round will come up...hoping for tomorrow, could be Wednesday, could be etc(Won't be Thursday though, as that's his birthday and I don't want to crack his brain on a festive day!). Heading into it blind as I was, I didn't figure on getting this far in the first crack at it.
My biggest problem thus far? Blasted ( ) and { } Maybe I need to mess with my resolution and line density in text displays somehow because that about drove me up the wall.
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Wrangled another Roguelike's script of sorts to look through and try to fix up. Also drafted to try and reproduce a crash in the same game that only seems to have happened to me. Also ringing the gong for Round 2 on helping out a bit more on LambdaRogue after getting knocked off the rails a bit these past weeks.
Yay for progress on this front since it looks like it won't be until sometime next week until Lesson #2 on programming. Gotta try to hit the gas hard this weekend.
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If you want to go ahead and get a headstart on the second lesson, there are thousands of tutorials on several languages. Now that you're able to compile and have the basics down, I'm sure you can easily follow them and steam on ahead by yourself :)
Best of luck :D
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If you want to go ahead and get a headstart on the second lesson, there are thousands of tutorials on several languages. Now that you're able to compile and have the basics down, I'm sure you can easily follow them and steam on ahead by yourself :)
Best of luck :D
I get the feeling I've got a ways to go on the basics, logic, and so on...let alone I don't even have one set of syntax roughly in my head yet. Took about 4 pages of handwritten notes, then typed them up, so those need to be looked over so as to not have missed some critical words amidst the machine yelling. I've got a small army of bookmarks that took about 3 and a half hours to organize recently as well...so once I've got a pair of legs on me then I can creep/walk/run at whatever I can think to---which will be a large variety of things since the only way I can hope to find ones that "click" with me is to experiment with the lot of them.
Heh, did update G.O.R.E. in the listings for Vala...and I thought Mordor XP switching from Ruby to some manner of Basic was random...
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Pretty well finished that Roguelike script revision the other day, though it looks like that crash might well have been waaay to random a thing to try and reproduce based on the hours I threw at it and seeing how it deals with randomization and whatnot. I'll post a news bit in announce once all is situated to the next step on it.
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Looks like I'm back for another full game completion and then a completion or so of what will be the new demo for that upcoming PC Retail RPG---seems to be 10 days or less timeframe wise on the full game completion.
Other less than stellar news seemingly on the horizon relative to the lot of things, will see it sorted once this is out of the way and as I try to contemplate on LambdaRogue.
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99.99% done(One fight left, but should you wind up getting the game...odds are...you'll see....) with all that there was for me to do with the upcoming retail PC RPG---now I need a few/some days to tend to everything that's backed up this past week or so then LambdaRogue becomes the focus heading into the mad rush of learning unless something else comes from the past out of the blue in dire need.
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http://www.heroicfantasygames.com/index.htm
Finally, they got it out and decently situated, leaving me to prmarily return to my wranglings and the havoc this did to my backlog while I was at it. The first(and quality!) retail project I was able to help out on, first of many more to come I hope. ;D
Give the demo a try folks, if nothing else it may help calm your cravings until the Oct 31st mega-revision of Incursion hits...
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Backlog amid othert issues proving stubborn this time around...though within the time period I did manage to add several bookmarks which I hope to come in handy once things really get rolling. Time delay on the crash coursing continues to my deep lament...that really needs to get situated sooner than later. :(
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Backlog nearly dead, crash coursing seems to have wound up hitting the major snag I was worried about...plan B will be organized and implemented soonishI hope, currently going insane at my PC acting up on me lately (mouse in particular which is pretty important on a desktop)---hoping to get that resolved so I don't have constant issues anymore.
Plan of following actions is to hit a playtesting streak on S.C.O.U.R.G.E. when all is resolved while getting back to the commitment to LambdaRogue. From there, outside of other stuff manifesting, more long-term oriented efforts will go towards reviving up/learning to manipulate the long overdue RAGe Engine for the good of us all and trying to successfully dive headfirst into Python 3.x so as to prepare for the works I aim to wreak upon Stardock's upcoming Elemental: War of Magic game. Also, of interesting note as I only recently discovered it as the devs haven't posted here in awhile, Legerdemain is looking to at last have a graphical version existing as of early June for any prospective artists as per their homepage. I'm hoping they find one as otherwise it looks to be awhile yet before I can manage to bang out any art assets(even moreso with this crazy mouse problem on top of my general system weakness and cooperation with programs). But hey, even if it takes months from now, I'll do it if it comes down to it as I would LIKE to play the game I bought w/ Guide Journal all those months ago ;)
Also, once the new PC hits or possibly before depending on how experiments go, I aim to somehow work in a series of Let's Roguelike video excusions on my vacant youtube channel or some such in a style somewhat like the various Let's Play series in order to get things more lively/known across the vast amount of worthy things to pay attention to new and old. (My biggest hope is some kind souls will respond in kind and have something similar out there for the ASCII ones unless I wake up one day and my brain is able to comprehend them outside Triangle Wizard.)
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First, I've got to say you're very dedicated. When you first proposed this, I wasn't sure if you understood how much work what you're doing is. But you've been at it now for three months, as dedicated as ever. So, good work! :D That's way more work dedication than I usually have.
Anyway, have you considered using Mantis (http://www.mantisbt.org/) or another similar issue management system to organize the work that you plan on doing? I mention it because slashie (http://slashie.net/news.php) seems to find it quite productive to say the least (http://slashie.net/mantis/my_view_page.php).
I think the Let's Play a Roguelike videos are really awesome. The only thing I usually don't like about roguelike videos on youtube is that they move so slow. But that's pretty minor. I'd love to see more of those videos.
In terms of programming, don't give up on C/C++. You probably need better books. This is my personal favorite (http://www.careferencemanual.com/), but not the easiest to learn from. The definitive book on C is probably this one (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_C_Programming_Language_(book)). MSVC can be frustrating, gcc and g++ adhere to the standards much better so if you're having problems with that you could install Linux to a flash drive or CD and boot into it to use gcc and g++. Many roguelikes are written in Linux natively. I would recommend Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntu.com/). I think Linux is much more sane to program for in general, but that's just my taste.
If C/C++ is just too much, you could try Pascal. Many roguelikes have been written in pascal, including some versions of the original Rogue. Java is also a popular roguelike language and much more forgiving than C or C++. Slashie even has a whole engine (http://code.google.com/p/serf-engine/) for Java roguelikes.
Anyway, good luck and keep up the amazing work!
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Thanks for the kind words. In the grand scheme of things though, I'm strongly banking on the next 3 months being ones I acquire more actual skills to bring to arms versus mainly research in game design concepts and mass organizing of this 3(Not that the latter 2 bits haven't been important in their own right...game design concept pondering will be an ongoing thing all the way I reckon).
-This Mantis thingie looks interesting---especially since I'd never heard of it or anything like it! I can envision a future when this somewhat replaces(Well...supplements...) just typing everything on notepad then emailing it to myself or some such as I'd figured prior. Bookmarked! Definitely, if you have any other links to similar things feel free to dispel my ignorance...I'm sure there are any number of handy things out there I've not the slightest exposure to.
-As I mention in the RGRD topic the other day that seems to have spun out of control, I've also some musings for MANY good practices that could be adopted using the streaming sites gaining pep nowadays...like Livestream I think is a biggie from NeoGAF's gaming board. If it could be configured properly, not only could people watch and comment on a Live playthrough with Tile versions or otherwise unlike Crawl's online ASCII spectating, but even more importantly in my mind, it could be used to do Live coding, animating, tiling, sound/music composition, etc in the form of workshops or being able to observe ongoing development of something and then contribute live without the barriers of OS, installs, time to muck around with, and so on. The potential utility value is huge and something I will surely need to look into so that things can work better for what I do and other people down the line as well.
-LOL, at this rate I couldn't give up on C++, at least even if I wanted to, since I already staked out my claim on RAGe and C++ lib is what powers the awesome thing. As to needing better books, currently, I have NO books but a mass assortment of links to online ones, tutorials, and guides. In my mind, I'd like to think I'll stand a better chance of purposefully decoding C++ so as to understand and visibly manipulate/get immediate feedback from the RAGe engine moreso than aimlessly typing at it to no specific end. The engine is pretty much unrestricted from what I can tell in large part and the manual explains the gist of a fair bit...but there's nothing else online with it so I might as well be rigging up something largely from scratch. When the time comes, I'm going to need to draft some people around here and over on Shrapnel to really see what's what and what needs/could need doing. You know the world is a crazy place when I of all people technically wind up on what would count as the cutting edge of engine manipulation since it is 1. Newish 2. Unknown as there's never been a concerted effort in the slightest on stacking it up against the rest.
-I know nothing of Linux and don't really have much in the way of links to boot, but obviously that'll have to change. Pascal and Java are on the list as well for different projects in the big one...though Java has a somewhat loftier place as another project I look to help out in some respects when I can is JavaClassicRPG
http://jcrpg.blogspot.com/
As to Plan B, while I never said it was a good plan, here's what it amounts to:
Yet again organize all my bookmarks at all relevant to game design and the related skillset---only this time in the form of a forum post on a site or so where I know there's knowledgeable folk afoot. Within this Gigantic post, which will hopefully prove to be very helpful to any other people interested in getting into game development, I will solicit people to help me "fill in the gaps" on the topics where I'm missing something(I've nothing on procedual generation), or everything(I'm POSITIVE there are magic tricks to learn/steal from the Demoscene people for Roguelikes and games in general along with the likes of that kkreiger project), as well as if there are any books they see as essential whose contents do not happen to be covered properly within the links to free online readings and such---goal being to minimize book buys overall as I'm broke and such though the plan is to have another round at it once I get a proper new PC sometime after October this year with the funds I'll hopefully have left after getting a friend to assemble a solid one.
Once they've confirmed additions or things of that nature...well...then there's nothing left by my own mad rush at the lot of main actors at the onset(Possibly in the form of this Livesteam dealie since this would likely be one of those 10+ hours things everytime/everydayish). If I get stuck on RAGe/Python 3.x/Squirrel/etc, then jump to a Tiling program, if stuck on said Tiling program, immediately jump to a Sound one, and so on until I come back around to the original offender or hit a breakthrough streak on one of the many that I hope to click with. Something akin to ruthless, savage pragmatism is the general notion. Besides, this should help prevent a common roadblock I've head people have in terms of getting stuck on "something" then the whole thing goes up in smoke at agonizing on it---in that I'll hop to the next thing that's related as soon as things go horribly wrong before it gets under my skin too much, well, unless I wind up stuck on everything. :D
Otherwise, another Darkhorse engine candidate has entered my frame of mind to compete with RAGe's C++ lib mystery and Elemental's Python monstrosity in terms of Roguelikes and figuring good stuff in general---Preditor! I love this video so much...this kind of video quality would be my dream on streaming or youtube, at leas the HD one.
http://www.torchlightgame.com/developerblogs/2009/08/28/preditor-scripting-101-part-1-of-3/
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Plans still about where they left off, still organizing and backlogging---the biggest issue being my mouse woes the same, if not worse, than before. Of course, when I had somebody over to look at it proper, it picked that half hour window to not mess up a single time so as to drag this whole mess out further. The lesson is clear to me...a mouse is damn important to general PC usage but I will surely bear in mind a straight keyboard control scheme for as many future projects of mine as possible. >:(
Still, so as to not lose the time on all fronts, I've been on a researching and..."evaluatiing" binge via internet and youtube in terms of game design and such. Resources also got a nice uptick within the last day or so as somebody thought wise to finally start a subreddit on Reddit for free and open(for the most part, ones that used to be physical books that either went out of print or the authors took a mind to it) computer science and such books...as well as eventual linkings to other such things as well---so I suspect much of that stands to come in handy at some point. In particular, I'm hoping one on reverse engineering and deciphering software will be mightily potent should I wind up backed into corners I think I might in regards to some projects...
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Conditions persist on the technical front, as do they on the game research and rampant bookmarking of information fronts...as do they on the not so good familial front.
I continue to more and more consider the notion of deconstructing other games off the beaten path so as to consider elements they possess for Roguelike fodder to be a good one as I keep researching and viewing the gist of different games over the years.
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:does a cautiously happy jig: Looks very likely the problem was with the mouse and not the PC outright. $10 later a new mouse will hopefully be on the way soon and, circumstances willing, handed off to my by my good friend by the end of the coming week since the world continues to discriminate against people with PO BOXES for some insane reason.
Meantime, keep banging away on game studies and again trimming the backlog that has creeped up throughout all these weeks. With some luck for peace of mind, I hope to actually play a videogame of some sort again in the not distant future...as it has been quite awhile now.
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FREEEEEDOMMMMMM! Finally got and tried out my new mouse this morning, and aside from a bright blue glow that'll take some getting used to and probably scare my cats, it seems to work very well if a tad sensitive. Which means it is time to shift focus off the research angle once more and dive back headfirst into things---though I have found some nifty stuff in the meantime both programming and game design related. Time to sleep less! 8)
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Give me your sleep, I need it! Heheheheheh ;)
G'luck with the new mouse mate, glad it's worked out. Keep us posted :)
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TANGENTIAL PROGRESS TOMORROW I hope! Specifically, I'll take on the challenge to become a collection of various embodied and disembodied voices for jCRPG http://jcrpg.blogspot.com/ Will try to help out with whatever I can after/alongside that as well that my still technically unskillful head can rattle loose while aiming to work quickly. It would appear a new public release version is on the near horizon so I trust Temple folk will give the game a shot and perhaps try to peg all that I will wind up as in the Land of Audio.
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Gah, "miffed" at how things went overall with a partial Version 1 of the audio recordings and today I got bashed in the head by a chandelier amidst this dreary, rainy weather. While an ice pack helped the latter, DO let me know if you've got something better than blasted Windows Audio Recorder on the former---I know my bad mic is insurmountable in some respects but there has to be a better software solution.
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Gah, "miffed" at how things went overall with a partial Version 1 of the audio recordings and today I got bashed in the head by a chandelier amidst this dreary, rainy weather.
Elig, add chandeliers to DreamHack! If you ever add creature descriptions, you should quote getter77, Dungeon-Crawl style.
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Gah, "miffed" at how things went overall with a partial Version 1 of the audio recordings and today I got bashed in the head by a chandelier amidst this dreary, rainy weather.
Elig, add chandeliers to DreamHack! If you ever add creature descriptions, you should quote getter77, Dungeon-Crawl style.
Ha, I needed the laugh today! Thanks Fenrir.
Otherwise, plan on the audio front seems to be a battle of wills and positioning with the mic and cracking open Audacity at long last to see what's up. Still hoping to wrap up this sound work as promptly as I can. Though as a long shot, if afterwards I can also come to some grips with some manner of music software in time...
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Gah, "miffed" at how things went overall with a partial Version 1 of the audio recordings and today I got bashed in the head by a chandelier amidst this dreary, rainy weather.
Elig, add chandeliers to DreamHack! If you ever add creature descriptions, you should quote getter77, Dungeon-Crawl style.
Consider it done! :D
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Gah, "miffed" at how things went overall with a partial Version 1 of the audio recordings and today I got bashed in the head by a chandelier amidst this dreary, rainy weather.
Elig, add chandeliers to DreamHack! If you ever add creature descriptions, you should quote getter77, Dungeon-Crawl style.
Consider it done! :D
LOL, remember to use my real name with any potential quote! 8)
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SUCCESS! Wit and courage hath served me well, for I've roughly gained a new skill this day. Next batch of recordings based upon my 2 hour straight fight with Audacity and my mic turned out so well there will apparently be no need for a V2 period. Will V2 some of the ones from yesterday to see what's what and do the sfx and remaining packs that hopefully go as well this weekend. YES! 8)
If anybody ever decides to reach out to the vision impaired with a Roguelike I call dibs on narration and such. :thumbs up:
In the grand scheme, since starting, I do believe this counts as the first new skill I've attained rough competence in---that's big! If I had to guess, next would be music...then a tossup between art and programming----all depending on which first manifests an idiot proof learning situation for me.
This made my day today. ;D
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Great work man, you're awesome.
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Great work man, you're awesome.
Thanks! Good tidings always help me to keep keeping on.
Progress got a bit derailed today with my forgetting that I won't have a good recording environ tomorrow, old giant cat needed some cold weather spoiling today, and I wasn't feeling too well this afternoon----likely tied into the sudden dip down into the 40's-30's weather wise around here.
Thus: I will try to be back at it full steam Monday....try to get an even earlier start to recoup this lost weekend. :D
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Got the V2 of my first voice pack squared away, and most of my Sound effects V1 pack seems to have rang true. Hoped to manage more voice packs today but the environ got noisy and unruly---so yet again I hope to get a pace up tomorrow. Updated the OP with a concise blob as to all projects I've touched somehow or another up to now.
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Upon a random thought, I took a gamble and tried to install the free demo verison of Scallywag: In the Lair of the Medusa this evening---it seems to work! I now also find myself unduly amused with the main menu theme the game has as it is very reminiscent of the Tristram theme in Diablo---but still nicely different and briefer. Should make for excellent playlist fodder for coding and such for Roguelike endeavors to come involving it, Torchlight, and others. Should I think to/remember, I'll take a crack at one of the video capturing programs and put the main menu/credits screen up on my youtube channel as the first vid.
Also, died quickly in the demo even on the default medium difficulty as that is the only selectable on on it. I still strongly recommend people give that a shot, the full game too, so I can have as big a base to test what I aim to do regarding it and/or Torchlight as things come together here.
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In hilarious irony, the new public release of JCRPG is up for download and hopefully to be enjoyed somewhat. Irony being, it turns out my PC is too old and weak to even make it past the main screen/manipulate said screen properly! :D
Plan is to come up with the build to assemble for the new PC in the very near future, to have delivered somewhere in mid-December.
Edit: Blast this day, now SomethingAwful is not allowing for viewing of threads to non-members again it seems. I really do have to consider a membership somehow as the discussions and such prove to be very informative on stuff I simply don't run across, or not in a timely fashion, elsewhere. Annoying damned policy though! >:(
Edit: I'll tell myself it is an investment for the future---can't fall behind now! :P
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Been in bad shape overall these past couple weeks, throwing progress off kilter which leaves me then in worse shape overall. Trying to force and and snap things back along into a proper frenzy but so far it has been elusive and short lived at best before something in the background undermines the lot of it. :(
A better environ and situation to apply myself within is a luxury I simply don't and won't likely have anytime soon though---so I'm stuck having to improvise.
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I'm terribly sorry to hear that things aren't going well. Try to stay optimistic and let us know if there's anything the community can do to help!
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Will do. For starters, better luck with PC mice in not-good situations as my new one got kinda broken last night amid the domestic strife. For some reason, it now won't work right on a mousepad at my side anymore, incredibly laggy, but will work on my leg---which is kinda unwieldy to manage to say the least. :(
Edit: Somehow fixed the mouse, essentially, with an old pair of underwear. Looks like this is going to be one of those weeks... ??? :-\
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Edit: Somehow fixed the mouse, essentially, with an old pair of underwear. Looks like this is going to be one of those weeks... ??? :-\
Now I don't know if that's a story I want to hear or not - it certainly sounds interesting.
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Edit: Somehow fixed the mouse, essentially, with an old pair of underwear. Looks like this is going to be one of those weeks... ??? :-\
Now I don't know if that's a story I want to hear or not - it certainly sounds interesting.
It doesn't make any sense. Mouse stops working on mousepad despite nothing being amiss with said mousepad. Thought it had pretty well broken totally until I randomly tried it on my sweatpants wearing leg...worked. Then eventually thought, "maybe it is a surface thing somehow?"...and went looking for something that'd fit over it/arm of a chair (I don't have a proper/good PC chair...have to make do with an old wicker rocking chair) yet smooth like the sweatpants. Pair of briefs from years back was the first thing I found and it worked. Why the mouse got damaged in such a way that it won't work on the intended surface it was designed for but WILL on this... ???
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One of those weeks indeed, lol. Underpants hahah (im so mature)
Is your mouse a laser or one of those old ball ones?
The old ball ones often dont work for usually fairly obvious mechanical reasons, and the laser ones have a habit of not working on very very smooth surfaces because of the way the laser reflects. if you're mousepad is plastic and not rubber/felt then that might be the reason :)
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Tis one of those translucent plastic laser ones.
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Also, looks like I'm not quite licked for a bit on jCRPG, a certain bat file allows me to run the game, and upon doing so briefly...there are many non-creative bits I should be able to help on afterall once things get caught up otherwise and meanwhile.
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Right, as it looks like tomorrow morning/afternoon will have me fully caught up again.
1. Help out semi-playtesting but mainly touching up the English text in jCRPG. Possibly see about figuring out musical composition for one particular piece (will be a big deal when this happens as it'd be my first composition)
2. See what's what in S.C.O.U.R.G.E. at long last assuming I can find some folk around it team wise to clue me in as the main page hasn't updated in quite awhile. Quite possibly the usual Miscellaneous helpings as I've done for KoTC, prolly jCRPG, and so on---but WOULD like to take the specific oppourtunity to learn a bit of scripting via it(Squirrel) before programming proper similar to how I aim to go from figuring out the gist of voice acting to musical composition.
3. In theory, beta helping for a project or so could begin sometime soonish...if it does above bits will either be hustled, gotten back to, or perhaps still done in parallel depending on how things shake out.
4. Somewhere in and about all of this, giving a deeper look to the Livening Roguetemple ideas so far and seeing what will be the fastest bits to knock out and going from there---perhaps finally getting around to a Roguetemple Youtube channel and so on. I'm not sure how my old PC here would do for video capturing for clips and such, but I'll see if a little bit can be gotten to. Odds are I'll set up another topic for people to converge upon to work out how the channel will be structured and who'll be on it and such.
Of course, we'll see if any random bits pop up outta nowhere that derail/enhance/??? any and all of the above.
All in all, I turn 25 in 13 days and will, hopefully successfully, retire this old PC a couple weeks past that. As such, I'd like to get some more accomplishments hammered out successfully and seeds planted on bits that'll take awhile by the time I'm a bit older and in the modern computing age.
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Modern computing age = A bunch of turbines in a case, making noise like a starting airplane.
I went back to an about 5 year old PC, which has mostly passively cooled components and is fairly silent. In between I had been using a more powerful, but also quite noisy box, since some game that I wanted to play needed that.
I really want silent PCs again. Unfortunately those cost a fortune nowadays, if one wants up-to-date components at the same time..
Just telling, that your step into a"modern computing age" can be a noisy one if you don't take care ;)
But good luck, and I hope you can enjoy your new PC!
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Yeah, I'll have to do "somethings" to cut down on noise a bit else it'll show up in the voicing bits and when I simply talk---time'll tell what steps will be cost effective to take as I already know that, in part at least, a cutting edge PC is likely out of my budget range---especially with my software things I'd likely need to grab after the fact. Low temperature and low noise would both be pretty swell to shoot for with the PC.
Otherwise, I'll compensate with music at a robust volume to drown it out. :P
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Otherwise, I'll compensate with music at a robust volume to drown it out. :P
That will work.
Also, winter is coming, and big headphones will act as ear warmers, and thus help to reduce heating expenses ;D
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RAAGE! So much for trying to finally the this Zune out of the box it has been in for awhile now and actually get things situated on it as I got my music organized today---can't detect itself USB wise even using the slot my mouse needs. :( Not to mention, my friend was mistaken when he said it had a proper pair of small headphones that came with it....EARBUDS are NOT headphones! >:(
We'll see if he can solve it....else the music will have to migrate to the spare external HD (please let it work correctly for this and so many reasons), then migrate from there into the new PC, then from there into the blasted mp3 player.
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Knocked out the first chunk of the English and such revision hunt today...either tonight or more likely tomorrow I should be able to make it in-game and check the same and such within!
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Looking likely my cat will now up and die come around about/on my birthday...so...given that kinda confluence of events...not sure where that'll put me in terms of the lot of things progress wise. Today/tonight has definitely not been a good one. :'(
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Woke up to it just now.
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Happy birthday, Brian!
Fenrir casts a wary glance at the cake.
That isn't chocolate; is it?
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Happe birthday!
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Alas, there was no cake or anything. Pretty grim day as I awoke to the death of my cat that's been with me over 15 years now----right after dreaming that he'd gotten better overnight.
Don't know what's what, nor if I'll get any sleep tonight. Whole thing's a mess. :'(
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I'm sorry to hear. Loosing a long year companion is hard. My last cat died many years ago, but the memories still hurt. Not that that would help you, just saying, I can feel with you.
There is little solace to give ... take your time, give it a humble funeral, and time for the sadness. Don't try to make decisions now, it's not the right time.
I hope your life turns easier soon again.
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Well, I had the day and a tiny bit of sleep. From here, I declare a mass bout of progress with updates in another topic I'll make later today. He was a pretty active Siamese, so it fitting that I ascend to another level of activity.
I did, Fenrir, eat a giant bar of very dark chocolate last night around 2am'ish.
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Phase 1 complete, topic made in Dev section. Next phase and topic tomorrow....much earlier in the day since this shouldn't take anywhere near as long.
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Finally about caught up again from my lost time of last week's bad week. Going to figure out those video(s) for the channel, then perhaps flip a coin or something as to where to start order wise for the next couple concurrent bits. Scallywag/Torchlight is out of the runnings until I get the new PC by virtue of not happening to have installed it from the disc after all this time due to backloggery. So, barring other things coming up like beta concerns, that'd leave begging on S.C.O.U.R.G.E., SFML perhaps, somebody saving me some time and figure out which of the various audio creation/manipulation programs can generate "symphonic styled" music via plugins or whatever, or reckoning some manner of tile/3D art at long last. Or some strange combo of the entire lot, or something else if it comes up---obviously I'm pretty well open for specific requests despite still being stuck on any further quest related help on LambdaRogue through these months.
Dinner comes shortly though...fresh cornbread with ground buffalo mixed with herbs, oil, my special sauce, and pasta. Grocery run late tomorrow morning that'll eat some time as well.
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I'm behind on things, but trying to get resquared away. Lost much time due to freezing cold sleep in the mornings---solved that today. Fell into a few Crawl SS games as well somehow.
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Seems it'll take a bit more wrangling than prior things to get ahold of the various S.C.O.U.R.G.E. team members to get me up to speed and whatnot since IRC is apparently random/infrequent. Time to leave messages forum wise or something, email, etc.
Update: Finally got their homepage to load again and sent a contact message upon seeing the lack of forum activity....here's hoping they'll take me in!
Also, PC stuff seems to be bumped to (Early I HOPE) next week on account of the usual, random, early christmas parties.
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Have fallen back into game research while awaiting word on this and that. :(
PC build finalizing bumped back to, HOPEFULLY!!!, Monday'ish. Need to get this settled expediently as I'm pretty sure I'll need it to successfully help out with Din's Curse which I expect to reach that stage come mid Januaryish---not to mention everything else. >:(
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Yeah....New Year's seems to have thrown the shipping just enough off course that, combined with break ending, it'll be Sat of this week before the PC gets largely started to be situated. :(
Otherwise, the situation with S.C.O.U.R.G.E. is starting to frustrate me without any headway...couple weeks now since message left, bit past a week since forum topic made----I can't stalk a blasted irc channel 24/7 for random appearances. >:( Worst case I may just have to find some other project to integrate into relevant to my aims and interests...but S.C.O.U.R.G.E. just seems to hit so many targets to good effect.
I do now have some aspirations/a slim set of chances towards the soon to be largely opened-up Achron project in the coming months though. I'm pretty sure their Resequence engine could be used to create one/some of the most ridiculous Roguelikes of all time. Moreso, the slim chance could entail me winding up with some pay/work out of it IF I can manage learning the right things(primarily they are looking for quality 3D models---a surely tricky thing to get to quickly from scratch) and applying them skillfully in time.
I guess this is but the first taste I'll have in terms of something not progressing smoothly on getting involved with a project----even if that is a smooth progression towards smacking into a wall to climb over.
Edit: Annnd now it would appear the Din's Curse work will slip back to closer to the end of January or so versus mid-month as they crawl out of closed Alpha and the semi-open Beta starts. So...I'm not really sure how to process that as it relates to looking into other things meanwhle or something else as "some weeks" counts as a significant chunk of time in my situation. :-\
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Well, S.C.O.U.R.G.E. looks to be going into stasis...fully...to the tune of eventually/possibly/depending metamorphing into a full conversion of sorts into jME/Java upon C++GL burnout and such. : ( ???
So...not really sure where that puts me in terms of getting myself integrated into something post Din's Curse beta that'll introduce me to a wide array of game development aspects/tools as this wasn't exactly an expected development. Maybe Planes of Sedia? I need ideas here folks. :-\
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In my opinion a good thing for the roguelike world would be to make Triangle Wizard with a graphic. Even the most simple graphic.. like static bidimensional black and white drawings of enemies made with Microsoft Paint.
This simple thing in my opinion could attract a lot more people to Triangle Wizard.. because after the initial impact (no graphics), the game is full of action and strategy and, most important thing, very playable even for people who have never played a roguelike before.
JM2C
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Time'll tell where Wouter takes it/how GameMaker evolves/as random things happen. I do share the sentiment that Triangle Wizard on the whole is chock full of potential.
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Well, I don't like my efficacy being reduced due to still being stuck with this busted mouse courtesy of the idiots of UPS that leave packages just lying around outside at apartment complexes, but the beta for Din's Curse is now underway so it is time for me to dig in VERY deeply. All other things on hold, same for any games.....outside of time sensitive stuff and bits here and there in the week and heading down and out to eat/sleep----this will get my utmost focus to the tune of in excess of 10 hours a day everyday that I am able to. If I can't handle singular devotion of time to this one project, it would bode rather poorly towards my own game making and otherwise related endeavors.
Wish me luck and success, for this will be ongoing for the next month or so. I'll still pop around here, obviously, but with less frequency as I'll have to streamline my internet checking for news and such while this is ongoing as it currently takes me awhile with so many places to check and things to digest.
Perhaps I'll even see some Temple folk helping to hash things out? 8) At any rate, the game will get my best efforts so as to ultimately be the best it can be in terms of what beta testing can bring.
18 times I'll need to beat the game bare minimum in the timeframe for proper testing...166+/- in theory.
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Darn that UPS. I'm a CS major myself. I lend my expertise to your endeavors and wish you the best. My project was referred to earlier, just clarifying it's Visual Basic .NET. I appreciate your interest in keeping the community alive. I try to visit here as much as I can, honestly it's mostly just a minute or two of reading posts. It's hard to dedicate a lot of time when I have so much on my plate with my projects and marriage on it's way (April 10th.) If you decide my expertise might help, you can certainly use my email address on my homepage. Email's just a phone-touch away for me.
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Darn that UPS. I'm a CS major myself. I lend my expertise to your endeavors and wish you the best. My project was referred to earlier, just clarifying it's Visual Basic .NET. I appreciate your interest in keeping the community alive. I try to visit here as much as I can, honestly it's mostly just a minute or two of reading posts. It's hard to dedicate a lot of time when I have so much on my plate with my projects and marriage on it's way (April 10th.) If you decide my expertise might help, you can certainly use my email address on my homepage. Email's just a phone-touch away for me.
Much appreciated and congrats on the impending marriage! 8) I'll likely try to follow up on things after this beta is settled barring some other unpredictable stuff coming up alongside getting that Intuous4 tablet to better facilitate things.
It'll also be interesting to see how that book shakes out.
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Well, leave it to me to take a shot in dark, thusly I've just applied for the limited closed beta for Basilisk Games Eschalon Book II
http://basiliskgames.com/
which would start in another week/couple weeks and then likely last a good chunk of weeks/monthish. Din's Curse beta seems to be at the final stages where I'm largely out of things to mention/beaten to mentioning things already confirmed by multiple people and more experience is more experience and with a different company/gamestyle---though this time around I do want to work in a bit of multi-tasking alongside my typical marathoning.
Of course, I could be horribly wrong and Din's may kick into some sort of extended overdrive....in which case if the 2 streams cross I guess I'll play with my sleep schedule quite a bit for the duration. :D
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I really admire the graphic designer that made the art for Basilisk Games' website. Being something of a casual web developer, I always appreciate a well designed site.
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Yo Getter if you need we could send off a few 'reference' emails to those guys saying "We really think you should hire this guy". :)
As far as what was talked about earlier in this thread about being included inside of a game, I think a 'getter' class would be great. In could be the equal of the rogue/thief type of class, someone who 'gets' things. Like a scavenger or agent in a scifi game.
Also bummer to hear about you being ill. I have dealt with a couple of 'near life' experiences over the past 3 years, so I know how brutal it can be.
So if I get anything more than just a movement engine into my project/s I'll definitely include you as a class or merchant/trader or something or other.
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Heh, they wound up going with a phased beta of sorts where, in theory, you could get accepted at any time but in general it is along certain breakpoints right up to just only getting in for a final run of the game within the last week or so of testing. On my end, just checking a couple times a day as the next/first jumping in point for those not on first string is this coming Thursday---pushed back from this past Sat or so.
I'd obviously sooner get in as early as possible to be able to successfully spend time with it, but there's still plenty of merit to it if I only just barely make the cut into the final pass group.
Heh, a "getter" class would probably just confuse and/or enrage the Super Robot fans unless it was the actual Getter in a game! Hence my bias towards an unorthodox unique Brian Jeffears lurking ingame. :D
My cold at least seems to be on the decline, and while waiting to find out on Eschalon/still thinking on Din's, I've been putting away the backlog and more game related studies in terms of other games.
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I had to look up Super Robot. Lol. Manga. I never got the appeal, but man I know a TON of fans. Good luck on the cold.
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http://www.soldak.com/Dins-Curse/Overview.html Well, that's that situated while I still wait to see if I make the cut for Eschalon Book II(Edit: Apparently now having a release target aimed towards end of April). Upon that, making an inquiry in one place, that tablet purchase to come, and this feeling I have like I've somehow forgotten something I meant to try/purchase game related in this past while...that'd round things out before seeing what for on PLOS and who knows what else. Perhaps such would come to constitute my participation in the ARRP event later in the year? Time and whatever else comes up shall tell....
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Well folks, it will do no no good to waver terribly on what is likely a necessity, so the deed is now done:
http://www.wacom.com/intuos/small.php
I was able to score one for only $199 and no shipping sizes thanks to Amazon. Bigger ones surely have their obvious advantages, but at my level, this stage, and the crazy skyward rocketing of the price for units greater than this one----even I'm not that crazy.
Thus, in time with much struggle, the key piece toward there being much Tiling and such the the world of Roguelikes shall fall into place. I would posit it to be almost a certainty to see my teeth cut upon it with PLOS and, I hope, one or more other Roguelikes over these next few months once I can manipulate the thing accordingly.
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Yay for new things out of the blue...intending to help out with the English text revision for Ash of Time. Tablet also apparently shipped out today instead of the 19th...so hopefully I can hustle up on everything.
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Tablet has arrived, will make sure it doesn't melt upon turning it on at some point today, the backlog still lives but is quite beaten back.
Soon I shall descend into a madness of learning and applying...
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Sounds like you've got your work cut out for you... Good stuff with the tablet, I've always wanted one! It looks like you're very ambitious and I respect that.. Consider me at your service, primarily for pixel art knowledge because I'm very aware of the subtleties of the art, but like I said, I'm most accessible through email! ;D
CHEERS
-ian
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Yay for that.
Boo for me just now getting internet service back due to a thunderstorm saturday night frying stuff all around our house...including my router. :'( Such a mess to come still, as well as gas problem with the stove....
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Still at the last of the backlog, now also intending to help out with Rayel in the same manner as Ash of Time. Eschalon Book II is set to release on May 16th, so unless I happen to find out something relatively soon, it will mean I didn't make the last cut afterall.
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Late doings, but I completed this latest bit of helping for LambdaRogue---to be seen in the next release. Yay!
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Now have contributed 2 files of English revisions/localization for Rayel. 8)
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As it is the 12th and I ultimately received no word back, I simply didn't make the cut for Eschalon Book II. Will still try to remember to try the demo at the very least to see how it has evolved from the first game. I am sad. :(
But on the other hand, another busy side-spurt arrives on me this day as I got accepted to do the English revision for the just-alive ToME 4! ;D Excited to work on a "legend" of sorts for the first time, and it also looks like I could get to see myself implemented ingame too upon some discussing of it. 8)
/aims his morning/afternoon at this now...good thing to wake up to!
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:hours later now:
...Right, that gets ToME 4's English script decently squared away! There's still more though, but outside of somebody else having a better idea, that will manifest from me hunting through Lua files in Notepad for known revision gaps and probably a host of other things as slim to nothing was actually available as any sort of text file---doings so far were mainly just me hunting screen by screen ingame. :P
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Should be all situated with ToME4's file hunt this morning or early this afternoon at the latest.
From there, I got accepted to try and help with another game that popped up lately---Summoning Wars! Translation will be about all I can help with anytime soon at least unless they decide to also salvage/double check permission some of my old doings from jcrpg.
I will poke around these apparent ".po" files straight away after the ToME4 doings, outside of eating something and whatnot depending on what time it all winds up being.
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ToME4 complete....now to look into this other thing...
Yeah, that other thing...just the biggest file left now. Thing is...this file is nigh 200kb in Notepad---this is going to take some doings even for me! :o
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Yeah...actually just now got finished with that one thanks to a good number of quests still being in German. Scarily enough, between hunting around in this as well as the Lua in ToME 4, I half suspect I might've come to understand how to actually read/interpret code just a bit---which is pretty nifty coming from being a blank slate.
Now to get things back on track backlog wise from this excursion, see about the apprenticeship project, and get to the bulk of Rayel and Ash of Time somewhere along the way when they are communicated to me.
Woo!
Might as well update the OP somewhat I guess. Somehow, I just don't feel right doing it until there is a verifiable sighting of me on a staff credits screen or website section, so just the one for now. Can't wait to be able to update it with the rest as their respective new versions make it out with my contributions to them! :D
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PLOS message sent, files backed up to the external, will get the tablet firmware'd up proper along with my software fate tomorrow morning.
Also, this marks my entry into the Nigh-Always On Phase. Meaning that I should have some combo Skype, Google Chat/Video, yahoo instant messenger, AIM, and my trusty Verizon cell phone bearing free nights after 9PM EST and weekends are the ready during my waking hours to collaborate on projects, chat Roguelikes, and pretty well in general as whatever comes up.
Which ultimately translates to me being available for talking/doings from about 7:30amEST until 11pm-12amEST---subject to not having to pop out for groceries and the like. I do foresee some late nights ahead though...
Still want to get some DVD-R's though..
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IT BEGINS!
STEP 1: Figure out SVN as I've never used it before...that any maybe the gist of the whole Clay thing.
Anybody up for explaining/showing the obvious....get to Skype/Google Chat/whatever and chime in this evening! I'll also leave a tab open here just in case.
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Hi. I'm afraid I haven't read through this whole thread (but just the first and last pages), so I'm not sure of the details, but it certainly seems that you should be applauded for tacking an enormous task. You seem to (still!) have a lot of determination. Keep up your attitude!
...Right, that gets ToME 4's English script decently squared away! There's still more though, but outside of somebody else having a better idea, that will manifest from me hunting through Lua files in Notepad for known revision gaps and probably a host of other things as slim to nothing was actually available as any sort of text file---doings so far were mainly just me hunting screen by screen ingame. :P
A funny story... I offered to DarkGod to go through and fix all the errors in the ToME4 text that I could find. I was quite surprised when he said someone had done it already. Mostly. He emailed me the files you had sent him, and so I set to work applying them to the source to create a patch. This took most of an evening. Who knows how long it would have taken DarkGod to get around to it; some of your finds were already obsolete :P. I did spot many more errors besides the ones you listed, but you did do good work (just don't be surprised to discover I made some changes to your rewordings :P). But the moral of the story is: for the love of god, don't list corrections in a text file, but just fix errors in files directly, and then create a patch - there was a lot of work wasted there. I'm glad to hear that you're investing time in learning to use SVN - you won't regret it! (Of course, you can create a patch against a file that is not checked into version control, but the patch files generated by SVN have the huge benefit of saying which version of the file they were created against, which makes them much smoother to apply)
Likewise: Notepad?! If you are going to do a lot of text editing, you should get a decent text editor, or at the very least, use a utility which lets you search multiple files for a regexp. I found many typos in ToME4 by searching for "minimun", etc. Learn about using regexps. If you don't like commandline utilities (like grep), try Notepad++.
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I did spot many more errors besides the ones you listed, but you did do good work (just don't be surprised to discover I made some changes to your rewordings :P). But the moral of the story is: for the love of god, don't list corrections in a text file, but just fix errors in files directly, and then create a patch - there was a lot of work wasted there. I'm glad to hear that you're investing time in learning to use SVN - you won't regret it! (Of course, you can create a patch against a file that is not checked into version control, but the patch files generated by SVN have the huge benefit of saying which version of the file they were created against, which makes them much smoother to apply)
Likewise: Notepad?! If you are going to do a lot of text editing, you should get a decent text editor, or at the very least, use a utility which lets you search multiple files for a regexp. I found many typos in ToME4 by searching for "minimun", etc. Learn about using regexps. If you don't like commandline utilities (like grep), try Notepad++.
Hi!
No worries on further revisions, as I mention I'm certainly no English Major or the like. It is necessary grunt work that I somehow don't mind doing and am able to wrangle at a decent pace for some mysterious reason---likely via still being helpless at any other helpful endeavors outside of beta testing and general game input.
Oddly enough, I got used to using Notepad and the like for this because, prior to ToME4 and Summoning Wars, pretty much everything that came my way was either in Notepad centric .txt files themselves or a situation where I had no code/file access and was going purely by ingame note-taking. I currently know nothing of patching and the like---closest has been some situations where I just e-mail back the .txt with corrections made and the filename changed to have an 'x' at the end of it. I would be nice if SmartSVN Foundation has some handy stuff to automate this as you outline---tis a foreign world to me.
While I don't know of/understand the meaning of 'regexps' and 'grep', (guessing the former is something registry related?) I did finally get around to installing Notepad++ the other day upon reckoning it might start to come in handy with the PLOS doings.
Speaking of PLOS doings, this week has mainly just been me .txt filing up my thoughts and experiences of revisions/crashes/etc---ingame and documentation otherwise. Currently very stuck on map making doings....but there's probably just one or more obvious things that aren't clicking yet----next week will hopefully see more organization/completing the set-up for VS2010 Express and the SVN client above/concrete doings.
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"Regex" is short for "regular expression," which is a way to match text with a search string. For example, "[red|gold|yellow] dragon" would match "red dragon," "gold dragon" and "yellow dragon." Similarly, ".* dragon" will match any word followed by "dragon" and so will match all of the above as well as "black dragon" or whatever. There's plenty of documentation online.
Grep is a a command-line utility that prints all lines in a file or files that match a given regex.
If you end up doing a lot of coding, you'll find that using one of the major keyboard-based editors like vim or emacs and having a terminal window open is a lot more efficient and less painful than using most of the IDEs and "notepad replacements" that are out there. Being able to use revision control systems is also an absolute must - eventually, you will make a change that you want to revert.
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eventually, you will make a change that you want to revert.
I almost laughed at how much I agreed with that.
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"Regex" is short for "regular expression," which is a way to match text with a search string. For example, "[red|gold|yellow] dragon" would match "red dragon," "gold dragon" and "yellow dragon." Similarly, ".* dragon" will match any word followed by "dragon" and so will match all of the above as well as "black dragon" or whatever. There's plenty of documentation online.
Grep is a a command-line utility that prints all lines in a file or files that match a given regex.
If you end up doing a lot of coding, you'll find that using one of the major keyboard-based editors like vim or emacs and having a terminal window open is a lot more efficient and less painful than using most of the IDEs and "notepad replacements" that are out there. Being able to use revision control systems is also an absolute must - eventually, you will make a change that you want to revert.
Going to have to remember all this, as while much of it still sounds foreign to me, it also somehow seems like a sensible/logical set of notions. Being able to do things efficiently, and quickly within reason, is surely something I'm going to ultimately be after once I get grounded on things given my concerns with "time" outright. Quite a lot of stuff out there afterall!
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I suggested Notepad++ as a text editor because it has a "find in files" feature and supports regexs, and probably has everything else you will need in a text editor for a while. It doesn't sound like you need a code editor. But I'm not actually very familiar with notepad++; I'm an emacs user myself. But emacs is a rather big step up from notepad.
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All these suggesionts are fine, but really depend on Brian's long-term goals.
Tools depend on what exactly Brian wants to achieve and what people Brian is helping -- he doesn't need revision control if he's working for a single developer who decided not to use such a system. Brian would invest too much effort in that case. On the other hand, if he's helping a team who already use SVN, he of course should use SVN, too.
He also doesn't need Vi(m) or emacs if he wants to learn to program, say (as example), only GUI based Windows software. In these cases, VS 2010 can _really_ be a good and easy-to-understand solution -- for a start. If he wants to go cross-platform, or ignore Windows, but develop for Linux or BSD, VS 2010 is of course not a good solution.
And finally, does he want to be a professional developer one day, or is it just for experience and fun? In the case of exp./fun, he should take all advices by professionals with a grain of salt.
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All these suggesionts are fine, but really depend on Brian's long-term goals.
Tools depend on what exactly Brian wants to achieve and what people Brian is helping -- he doesn't need revision control if he's working for a single developer who decided not to use such a system. Brian would invest too much effort in that case. On the other hand, if he's helping a team who already use SVN, he of course should use SVN, too.
He also doesn't need Vi(m) or emacs if he wants to learn to program, say (as example), only GUI based Windows software. In these cases, VS 2010 can _really_ be a good and easy-to-understand solution -- for a start. If he wants to go cross-platform, or ignore Windows, but develop for Linux or BSD, VS 2010 is of course not a good solution.
And finally, does he want to be a professional developer one day, or is it just for experience and fun? In the case of exp./fun, he should take all advices by professionals with a grain of salt.
Long term, there are many tough questions that I don't yet have an answer to. The ultimate goal is to either function as a team member in a professional game development environ, Indie most likely, or to sell my own games and such as a one-man business entity---or a bit of both as some have managed here and there. I do lean towards essentially multiplatform entities for future personal things to sell, as I'd surely be doing myself no favors by cutting off a potential income bearing audience like Mac/Linux folk. Being that there are several such things in that camp, that is still a ways out there in the future.
Utter ignorance as to my aptitudes has me favoring seeking out a large variety of things to understand and sample moreso than doggedly focusing on a narrow spectrum of colors that I might not ultimately even be able to "see". I harbor no delusions of being one of the world's top people among any one area of expertise, unless I got backed into a corner by some future project to help out with that actually needed such. Rather, "just good enough" to be solid work/demonstrate understanding within each thing in turn is the goal for me. But yes, what each project deals with in terms of languages, engines, and other quirks is what I'll have to seek to learn about and adapt to---as I surely wouldn't last long in a team setting being unable to understand the code and all else of others.
I hope to take in as many useful bits from professionals and otherwise as I reckon things could come in handy in unexpected ways---whatever works for me is fine by me. By investigating this and that in the times between specific focuses that occupy my attentions, it should lend some clues as to my Strengths and Weaknesses thus far, as well as inch me forward to what "my" languages/engines/tools/etc of choice would be for personal projects either of the free nature for my portfolio's sake and general enjoyment by all----or that which I hope to sell in order to not starve to death and whatnot while allowing for more possibilities in the future what with money being handy for software/hardware.
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Ah, the good feeling of technicality progress, OP updated. :D
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Sometimes I think, the information on the internet is much too unstructured to be of use for you, getter77.
I'd think it could help to learn by slices ...
Like
- Goal: Make a simple "hello world" program in C
1) Get the tools needed to develop C
2) Learn as much about C to create a hello world program
After this, you have an impression if you liked the process, if the tools worked; maybe also where the tools that you chose were lacking. Also, if you are comfortable with the language or want another one rather.
I've been used to learn from books. Nowadays I use the internet for searching information, but this is easier with the background knowledge from the books. There are bad books, admitted, but good books really help a lot to get into something, like programming. Or to learn the basics of painting. Or photography ... many topics I think.
I'd say, try to books to learn the fundamentals of topics, then try the internet and looks for the information that the books did not contain.
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I've got a smattering of books within my bookmarks pointing towards Amazon relative to various entities within the lot of this, just a matter seeing how it goes versus online sources human and otherwise.
As to the hello world idea, I'd thought of something similar on the personal projects end once I get some general understandings from this stint with PLOS. Rather than hello world though, my notion would be to recreate the backbone of one game type or another from language to language...engine to engine---displaying something, sound functioning, movement, triggers, etc relative to whatever. My reasoning is that the classic hello world example might not give an accurate impression of how a given thing handles the variety of responsibilities it would have to live up to in realistic terms of game development. That said, this site will probably give me an idea of the look of various tings. :D http://99-bottles-of-beer.net/
OP updated as well!
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my notion would be to recreate the backbone of one game type or another from language to language...engine to engine---displaying something, sound functioning, movement, triggers, etc relative to whatever. My reasoning is that the classic hello world example might not give an accurate impression of how a given thing handles the variety of responsibilities it would have to live up to in realistic terms of game development.
I agree up to a point. Such a backbone is quite a huge task for a beginner, because it requires knowledge in many fields.
- Language syntax
- Methodology (procedural, functional, object oriented ...)
- General handling of data
- General handling of events
- Domain specific knowledge: Sound, Graphics
- Representation of game objects in the chosen language and methodology
I may have blown up this list a bit more than necessary. But I hope to show that such a backbone needs a lot of knowledge in a lot of fields, and I think it is too big for a training project, unless you already know about at least 30% of the issues.
Besides the points above I'd like to add:
- User interface design
or, more general, human-machine-interaction. It is not a key to success, but if you do it wrong, people will not like your products. So it is important to know about it, for the later projects of yours.
For the huge list of books, I'm not sure if this is good. My first book to learn C was bad. The second one was good, and got me going. You don't need more than one book for this, if you get the right one at the beginning. try to shrink the list to the essentials, and get one book - to get into programming, I'd either suggest a language specific book, or a methodology specific book. The more practical people will like the first, the more theory inclined the latter.
I'd save on books about game design, graphics and such until you have a firm idea of how programming languages work, what sets the one apart from the other, and which methodology suits your way to think the best - for example, some people like to think in objects, others find object oriented programming very counter-intuitive. You must find out what suits you, or train yourself to "think" in the way that fits to your tools. If it means something, it took me 3 years to get used to object oriented design after some years of procedural design work, and I never really got a good grasp on functional programming, although that is a very mighty concept too.
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Surely it is complex, but then again, it is plain to all that I've got a lot of work cut out for myself. I still have to check for the obvious though outside of it being made clear by others...IE: I probably need not concern myself with D: anytime soon as I don't think it is quite "there" in terms of the range of game dev features versus the likes of C# or some such---that helps! Most of the books I've bookmarked are of the general sort moreso than language specific, though there are surely some of them as well. Really, I've quite a lot of bookmarks despite being regularly amazed at regular gaps I discover in tit. The notion in the back of my head is to investigate more personally, for the most part, each "thing" in turn after being introduced to it withing a given project I'm helping out on and coming to work with it from there. For some other things, well, I may have to roll the dice ahead of time for monetary concerns: For example, depending on how things time out, the next major release of the Unity3D Engine carries with it a rather not minor pre-order discount...and the writing on the wall seems to be it will be a significant player in the times ahead up against the like of UDK far moreso than the likes of Torque and such.
I'd like to think I'll walk away from the work on PLOS this Fall/year with a far better understanding of all the various parts and interworkings in game design, along with my first slate of technical/artistic skills. As time passes up to that point, any number of chances to the side to work on and learn other things can avail themselves----I hope.
The biggest thing is minimizing disruptions in everything regarding working/learning and successfully managing rather robust marathons on one thing or another just as soon as I can get a grip on it---like art or populating an item list and the like.
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IE: I probably need not concern myself with D: anytime soon as I don't think it is quite "there" in terms of the range of game dev features versus the likes of C# or some such---that helps!
Why not stick to the traditional languages for the start? Most roguelikes are written in C, so there is a lot of previous experience. Example code, and people whom you can ask for help, because they already wrote a roguelike in C.
Also, once you know one language of a kind (I'd classify C as a procedural language here), it is fairly easy to move to another one of the same kind later.
Unity3D, UDK (Unreal development kit?) and Torque seem very much overpowered, and even unsuitable to make a roguelike. or do you have other plans? These tools are more geared towards 3D games, if I'm not mistaken, and that again opens a new domain to learn, at least if you stay a lone wolf developer - modeling, rigging, skinning and all these questions that are unique to 3D graphics. 2D allows you to paint a lot of things, and you can start with less knowledge and skills ...
For monetary concerns, I'd say stick to free tools and resources. For training projects, or first games, these are good enough. The open source community is huge, and has created a lot of free and good tools and libraries.
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IE: I probably need not concern myself with D: anytime soon as I don't think it is quite "there" in terms of the range of game dev features versus the likes of C# or some such---that helps!
Why not stick to the traditional languages for the start? Most roguelikes are written in C, so there is a lot of previous experience. Example code, and people whom you can ask for help, because they already wrote a roguelike in C.
Also, once you know one language of a kind (I'd classify C as a procedural language here), it is fairly easy to move to another one of the same kind later.
Unity3D, UDK (Unreal development kit?) and Torque seem very much overpowered, and even unsuitable to make a roguelike. or do you have other plans? These tools are more geared towards 3D games, if I'm not mistaken, and that again opens a new domain to learn, at least if you stay a lone wolf developer - modeling, rigging, skinning and all these questions that are unique to 3D graphics. 2D allows you to paint a lot of things, and you can start with less knowledge and skills ...
For monetary concerns, I'd say stick to free tools and resources. For training projects, or first games, these are good enough. The open source community is huge, and has created a lot of free and good tools and libraries.
It may be that traditional languages are the start---actually I suppose it would be now as PLOS will have me using Visual Basic 2010 Express for the first time ever and, IIRC, Visual Basic has been around awhile in some form or another. If I get to help out in a projec that uses something else like Java and the like, well, time to learn on Java as well. ;) I'm still not near the stage of the Grand Roguelike Hunt with some targets listed in the OP...at least not the programming centric ones. Otherwise, I find myself somehow intrigued by "newer" languages, perhaps out of some vague thought of "If these are going to gain ground and possibly replace some of the older ones in the developing future, might I be well served to get in on the ground floor while everybody else is also at a roughly comparable starting line?" Same thing for Engines and the like, as it would strike me as a colossal waste of time to try and come up with my own Engine outside of some rather novel situation where a suite of ideas in my head simply can't be done properly in a modern one available to me(It is a crazy thing Journeyman is managing with the Incursion rewrite...check his last news post or so!)----to writ, it then becomes a given to be familiar with the strengths and weakness of at least the biggest/actively developed modern engines.
I hope it is easy for me to go from one language to another once I understand programming in general---I've seen anecdotes on both sides of the fence and can't help but be a bit nervous as to which one I'll end up on and potentially having to slog the rest of the way onward. :-\
My plans both include and go beyond Roguelikes in terms of game development ideas and aspirations----though mainly it involves an infusion of Roguelike sensibilities such that I think would enhance other genres. I am more of a 2D versus 3D person, but then again, especially with the cusp of the "other" kind of 3D seemingly having arrived for real this time---who's to say where my fancy and, more importantly, knacks may lie? Just to discredit myself further, I DO have ideas even more/at least about as radical and unorthodox versus the craziest of the Talkies buried in the annals of the Newsgroup and Basin---though I elect to keep those under my hat until I can actually get things physically done to sidestep that "Talkie" designation and having Krice think I need more mental health procedures and treatments than he already does :P
Unity3D, name aside, can function pretty decently in detailed and active 2D doings as Arcen Games elected to use in in their 2D puzzler Tidalis(Quite nice actually, I've not gotten into a puzzle game outside of Tetris in a long time) and will also be porting their well received AI War franchise to it in the near future. Also....it just seems very nifty(especially the features for Version 3 coming sometime this summer) and the license terms for free use are quite appealing in general----could well be that I'd ultimately have no use of the Pro version features and I think I can cry myself to sleep just fine for a $1500 upgrade should I make more than $100K selling a game made by myself.
Free tools, so long as they don't preclude me from trying to earn a living via selling what I make with it aiding, are surely in the cards. I will, though, freely admit to having a bias towards something I can learn from scratch on and use up through releasing for sale, as opposed to learning on one thing that is mandated free then having to migrate to something else entirely to release likewise. That said, again for hopeful employment aspirations, working or demonstrable knowledge of various 'not-free', but clearly useful/popular, software certainly couldn't hurt me. It also shouldn't be outside the realm of possibility that some paid software serves me better than a free alternative in terms of the learning curve, ease of use/UI, and so on----as a money/time time/money threshold isn't exactly unlikely in my future. : (
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If you want to got professional, it is a good idea to investigate the non-free tools, since some of those are really a notch up from free tools. Tools like Poser, or maybe Maya for 3D content.
On the "new vs old" programming languages: I just recently saw a chart that claimed that C is the most commonly used language again after some year of other languages being in the lead. C was invented in 1972, and now 38 years later is still very common, or even the most common language if the chart was right. I agree that newer languages might have features which the old ones didn't have - but being in use for 38 years, and ranging among the top still, seems to say to me that it has proven it's suitability for a real lot of applications.
I don't want to say everything new is bad. I just think for the first steps it is good to use something well known and proven. From such foundation you can start to explore the more experimental grounds.
Best of luck with your plans :)
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Nothing matters half so much as getting used to the frustration of experimenting with new tools. Spend a few days pumping as many hours as you can into a couple of languages and their respective interpreters, compilers, or linkers. You will not make any progress with books or their kin. You might think that sitting down with something new and spending two or three hours completely frustrated is a waste of time and discouraging -- but it will be a basic part of your life from now on.
Things will go wrong. They will not work. It will not be your fault, but it will eat hours of your life. So dive right in and get used to it, and learn how to use the language you choose while you're at it -- there's more to a language than its syntax and semantics, after all. If you can't use the toolchain (I mean again the compiler and linker or interpreter), you can't use the language. So just dive in.
C is a great way to go. On a Linux box, especially, nothing is easier to get working. Lua is great, too, for the same reason, and it has great relevance in gaming. And remember always that the bulk of game logic -- the stuff that you'll be contributing the most to with your ideas -- has nothing to do with graphics or sound, or even the grid layout of a roguelike. You can testing new ideas for combat systems, or conversation AI, or alchemy even when you only know printf and its peers.
Of course, reading source is the second most important thing to do (next to writing it), and it sounds like you've started doing that.
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Well, the financial angle largely precludes me from affording the top end of the professional spectrum, especially given it is early yet/I don't know exactly how the laws and procedures go in my state for becoming a one-man home business entity of sorts----the free and not terrifyingly expensive shall be what I accomplish things with. It makes for a tricky balancing act in my head where my interests, tastes, and needs all wind up being pretty broad with only so much 'me' and hours in a day to reconcile the lot of it while trying to keep tabs on the lot of things for gamechangers as they pop up.
I surely do appreciate all advice and thoughts on the matters Hajo---I hope you never elect to not offer an informed take on the situations as they come.
On a brighter note, after a series of service techs----it seems more likely than not that my internet connection woes will abate.
Edit: Yes, being able to throw 10+-24 hour days repeatedly at learning/doing something once I have enough momentum is my hopeful ace in the hole considering other people have managed to learn things on a part-time basis after many months at it. If I keep making different mistakes each time, that should be a sign that I'm on my way at least somewhat. I know nothing on Linux though...another one of those areas what will surely come up at some point to where I'll have to get informed/some sort of distro or Virtual Box configuration as I'm just on Win 7 64.
Lua seems like a good idea in general as I've heard scripting is pretty swell...perhaps I'd do well to learn/contribute on ToME4 in this regard given how "fresh" and utterly dependent on Lua it is.
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(It is a crazy thing Journeyman is managing with the Incursion rewrite...check his last news post or so!)
PS. That would be here: http://www.incursion-roguelike.net/news (yowza!)
As always,
Minotauros
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My point, and I'm undoubtedly reiterating what other people have said, is that planning is of very little use. Even if you can only devote a single hour at a time for now, you must do it. You cannot put off the early phase, and ten hour pushes aren't useful until you've got the hang of a few tools, anyway, and started to get a feel for the languages you want to know. There are even interpreters for various languages running from websites -- you can play with http://doris.sourceforge.net/lua/weblua.php (http://doris.sourceforge.net/lua/weblua.php) to try some simple Lua, for instance.
Play with TOME4. That sounds like a fine idea. But the point is, you've got to start, and start now. You can't go on hearsay.
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I just recently saw a chart that claimed that C is the most commonly used language again after some year of other languages being in the lead.
I'd like to see the link to that please. No offense, but that's absurd.
http://langpop.com/
It's a far cry to say it's the most popular. It certainly won't disappear for a while but there are many other viable languages out there and it should always depend on the programmer as it's entirely dependent on the scope of project and preferences he or she may have. During my studentship of computer science they taught in the beginning programming classes: Java, C, and C++.
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:good stuff to keep in mind:
you can play with http://doris.sourceforge.net/lua/weblua.php (http://doris.sourceforge.net/lua/weblua.php) to try some simple Lua, for instance.
Play with TOME4. That sounds like a fine idea. But the point is, you've got to start, and start now. You can't go on hearsay.
NICE, that's a new bookmark I'd not come across before right there----perfect example of the "obvious" sneaking past me as I build a set of resources to consider and avail myself of. You've surely my thanks Joshua Day!
I hear ya on the "early phase" notion, that was what I meant by initial "momentum" I'm currently trying to get the ball rolling on snowball-on-a-snowcap style via PLOS.
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I just recently saw a chart that claimed that C is the most commonly used language again after some year of other languages being in the lead.
I'd like to see the link to that please. No offense, but that's absurd.
It was printed in a computer magazine, so I have no online reference. Thanks for providing a online source with better data!
But the first chart (Normalized Comparison) says C is second only to Java while my chart said Java just dropped under C, so the difference isn't that big. I'd think the question in ranking 1 and 2 can be from different interpretation of the same source data and I wouldn't really bother. Nice though to see Java on top in that chart since I'm more inclined to Java than C :)
Anyways, thanks for the link!
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OP updated with some sideline help I did that turned out to be rather appreciated.
http://www.classicgamesremade.com/
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This list is meant to grow and shrink over time and as people can better inform me of projects out there and these in question. If you have some to mention, or can clarify on anything I’ve got a question mark on, please do so in this thread.
[...]
H-World Yes Lua, ?
This is one of my old projects. The core is C++, it used Lua for scripting. If I can help with anything, let me know.
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Will do Hajo. Of course, feel free to resurrect and/or liven it up again as the notion strikes completely regardless of myself doing a single thing. 8)
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I lack the right development tools currently. But it's been one of my better tries to make a game, and would be worth to be revived once I get into C++ development again.
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Right, due to the odd course of events:
Does anybody know of a 2D, digital oriented(non-animated), Glossary of Terms/Vocabulary with application examples out there? I have a learning quirk in this regard----even moreso the fact that one can't effectively "sample" what is out there without having the, surely finite, list at one's disposal. Google has been less than helpful despite this striking me as something that would be rather "obvious"....
I lost a lot of ground this week with familial turmoil and hope to roar back this weekend with this Key Tool at my disposal.
Please help!~
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Well...PC kinda got utterly screwed up early yesterday morning---had to reinstall Win 7 entirely, lost much, only today able to start picking up the pieces to get back up to speed on everything. :'(
I blame Zonealarm and will probably never use the thing again. Anybody have a recommendation for a LIGHT, non-bloated, free Win 7 64 compatible firewall? The kind of firewall a man dreams about....the kind where it doesn't freeze in such a way while updating itself that it causes such a gigantic problem..... >:(
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What about Windows own firewall? It should be good enough in most cases.
For a list of 2D graphics terms, I can't help, but if you have terms that need explanation, or if you look for a specific term and can describe the thing in other words, I might be able to help.
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The idea of purchasing or even using a free firewall other than the one built into your windows OS seems a little unnecessary. I've been into pirating [you like it, you buy it] since the 90's without a firewall (to be honest, i only have antivirus detecting software installed on a quarter of my computers.) The important thing is to understand how to secure your computer, keep it up to date and maintained, and to understand what the threats are and what they look like out there, not to mention how to avoid them. If you have a router it's generally unnecessary to install a firewall. (I think most of my hatred for them stems from their overhead, not that I avoid them completely, they do have their practical uses, none of which consists of your average joe's everyday computing.)
I would say though, ZoneAlarm is one of the best out there. Generally most of the errors or problems that occur with such software is user error. There are many others out there, though only a few are less intrusive and likewise less capable at times.
I do wish you luck in finding something that suits your purposes.
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Well, I've the Win 7 firewall going now...mainly it is just out of habit I suppose from older PC's on different operating systems. I'm just on a straight cable connection though, so no router magic for me. Well, not anymore since that storm fried the old router, but oh well.
It'll do for now same as MSE for anti-virus purposes....moreso I'm focused on getting back on track as expediently as possible. I got screwed up for a good while yesterday trying to get my monitors reconfigured again---everything was flipped AND backwards and on the wrong monitor for awhile there, which if you've never done it, REALLY is a pleasure to try and navigate to de-screwup via the mouse. :D
Duly noted on the Art issues, as apparently if such a resource is out there it is hiding FAR too well. Hopefully I'll still manage to come across it soon, or a certain contact might well just make it himself and stick it online somewhere from when he couldn't find it either. :P
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(Just wanted to give you props for the continuing effort, getter. Go get 'em.)
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Thanks jim, I surely appreciate it.
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Slowly coming to understand the world of the digital arts today....somehow resulting in the whole Raster v. Vector situation floating all about my head alongside some new bookmarks. Hoping to manage my first graphical tile using GraphicsGale combo'd with GIMP for finishing touches in the near(ish?) future...
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Many maddening delays, derails, distractions, and displeasures later: I finally got done with my Gist-Combing of Art program Manuals and now have the gist of the gist of various concepts, methods, and terms wafting around in my head---to hopefully become more concretely known in the near upcoming future.
Once I get on pace art wise, though my initial doings are probably technically enough so as to last the next several months depending, it'll be time to hunt for more projects to contribute to in an accredited manner testing wise and perhaps otherwise as it goes while still keeping an eye out and at the ready stance for the other things I know of that I haven't heard on just yet.
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Time to help yodhe in the very near future, though like everything else it keeps getting derailed with my rapidly deteriorating situation.
I'm contemplating how it might go to try and forego sleep far moreso, including abstaining from old tricks like caffeine and the like, in order to have more time to get more things done and try to work on things.
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No dude, artists do their best work when they charge headfirst into complete disaster, needles hanging out of their arms and eyes widely dilated. Both ends! Burn the candle at both ends!
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Creative juices disrupted due to not feeling well at all, waiting to hear back on some of a fair number of things to try and keep/regain pace on everything---or at least the stuff not needing said juice at first. :-\
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Man. I can't believe how dedicated you are. I wish I was able to apply myself to everyday work as seriously as you have to roguelikes.
This is a great idea. Don't make your own roguelike - help the myriad of other ones out there with various ancillary tasks to keep the developer able to focus on the important stuff.
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Isn't it kinda badass? It's almost romantic in a goth kinda way. If only more geeks were women.
Or maybe like that one song in RENT. Wow, am I dating myself?
Yeah, much admiration for the project. Sideline work on the roguelike scene. Talk about an unsung hero.
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Thanks as always jetman and jim----dig around more in the forums jetman and you will see I've been beating the "marketing" drum, of sorts at least, as well for a good while so no worries at all as you've surely not rambled. ;)
Still not feeling well, trying to get back on track, trying to position to get onto more things. Some pretty bad times here at the house tend to knock me off my feet so the arising anew to continue onward part is stymied by it. :-\
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Wow, you're still going! I think this thread was the one who made me join a while back.
You seem as dedicated as the Dwarf Fortress devs. I hope you get as much appreciation as you deserve and good luck :)
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Yet more closed beta doings afoot, one of which with the hilarious caveat of being decidedly ASCII(As in, I have to figure out how to get the thing to display in the window box without cutting off stuff on the right-hand side pretty well soon here...) in nature(None more surprised than me, maybe the last assumption I make for a good long while!..).
So, given my issues with such traditionally...this'll be an interesting, and hopefully reach/grasp enhancing, trial! 8)
I still really need to get that art side of things moving though....c'mon inspirational and/or creative spark~
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I'm currently in...not good shape nor been feeling well. A bad rut and not predicted rut in every single way really...
I've not been able to manage existing commitments like I feel I should, even if I have been trying/slow/dripped little bits of progress on most of the fronts----the results just aren't there to the degree I've always shot for in all prior doings. It leaves me feeling let down with myself/not living up to what all I said and intended to do, as well as hampering the overall progress of whatever on account of my guns not firing all that rapidly or accurately. >:( :(
I'm trying to turn it around, to at least get back on track with the existing things before jumping at anything newly unforeseen until I can at least shake this...terrible slump.
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I'm not sure if I can really help much (also I'm not sure if I understood all of your text correctly); it might sound cheap if I say "try to relax and keep things easy". But more seriously, it's all free and volunteer work that you do, and your health and well being should be first, before any project obligations.
Take some time off, people sure will understand that you need a break. Do things that you feel helpful to recover and stabilize your situation, and then try to start again.
Good luck and get well again soon :)
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Well, the issue is all of it is something along the lines of "work-training" to me---stand no chance of finding work nor making a game of my own with getting the various skills functional that these projects have been gracious to indulge me in. The economy in the US, especially down here in GA, is in pretty bad shape which somewhat leaves me feeling a bit more and more cornered over time.
I know full well I'm at least a tad overloaded stress-wise due to the myriad of things in the background, but so far slim to nothing makes an impact on evening things out aside from brief spurts of food experiments in the kitchen and minor feasting on good meals/pizza. In other words, I'm having trouble enjoying...well...just about anything at all anymore---even things that still technically interest me. It is a wire crossing of sorts that I never imagined would happen so it is throwing me for a loop as I try to take stock of things and push ahead...
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Sounds a bit like a (mild?) case of burnout. If there is nothing anymore that looks enjoyable, you risk slipping into a real burnout.
I'm not sure if doing game project to get into the game industry is a good way to find a job - it might work, but it definitely it is no easy way. I'd assume that general IT jobs also fit to your skill profile, and those are easier to get.
If you get burned out, your job options will be even slimmer. Before this happens, try to find a good balance between training/working, and recreation.
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Hey Getter, if there's something we can make to help you just let us know.
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Don't worry, getter. You're just in the middle of Act II. Act III is where you find some kind of catharsis and burn more gloriously than ever before.
Honestly though getter, one thing that helps, ALWAYS helps, is to try something new. If you haven't been out in the woods for a while, go check them out. The leaves are starting to turn in your area, aren't they? Is there a sweet blues group heading through your town? Is there an old buddy that you wouldn't mind playing correspondence chess with? How about that awesome old short story that you were going to (re)write? How about that great novel you were supposed to read? Why not learn the names of 50 constellations? Go for a swim?
I'm not meaning to be trite. It's just that I'm prone to deep, deep fits of sullenness, and I know that one way to get better is by force-feeding oneself emotional vitamins... and these vitamins are best imbibed in the form of everyday, beautiful experience.
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-That's the damnedest thing though Hajo. All of the existing things, and even more somehow, DO look very enjoyable as do they catch my attention and fire off things in my head logic-wise. Yet, when I try to get down to each one in turn...the engine just turns over but doesn't start, so to say. I've heard of burnouts like you mention, where it all just becomes a blur if not something reviled...but not one where it feels like I'm just suddenly missing some puzzle pieces...
-I'm thinking my odd spurt of experiments on pizza making occupy the "new stuff" tangent...especially as that is somehow the only thing that has went "up" as the rest went "down". I've made a point of sampling/using many of the world's spices, seasonings, sauces, and cheeses(I've hit roughly 52 cheeses as of this past Saturday, with some picture taking along the way though many were lost when this new PC had that horrible episode some months back)---with some notions of experimenting with doughs/breads and meats. While my area is far from lively, I've also been exercising moreso lately now that something resembling Fall/Winter is here past the wretched GA heat.
How weird would it be if I somehow wind up some esoteric cook/chef-thing that wrangles game stuff on the side? :D
I appreciate all the well wishing and constructive feedback though, definitely.
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Has anyone mentioned noteye in this thread yet? http://www.roguetemple.com/z/noteye.php
Might be a bit more practical. Plus there's the upside of 3d as well.
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noteye is certainly a cool thing with much potential, though certainly would take some doings to poke the vast amount of older projects out there with it that would perhaps be compatible.
Otherwise, my fall of shame continues. :( I very much dislike not living up yo my word and intentions, so to be in a position where, for whatever reason, that's taking place on about 4 fronts now...it is as infuriating as it is disheartening/depressing. It is like a TV stuck on static in my head.
I would not even know how to give up though, as this is all I have left really...not to mention the root of it is just about all I've ever had in terms of something that resonated with me growing up, as weirdly timed a resonance as it is.
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Now older, somewhat hungrier, and at least a bit wiser for the stumblings forward and to the side, very often to the side, in terms of my doings while 25. 8)
Still in a period of game design and implementation study while feeling that will wrap again sooner than later and hopefully the food for thought is enough to munch my way towards new avenues. Still hoping for a re-sparkening on the Art and such front though as the importance of such is front and center in my mind.
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Hi, Getter.
Ever thought of a side project?
I write Paper and Dice RPG's and often find when one project becomes a jumble of inconsistencies, problems and a strain of creativity, i start a side project. Something easy.
It helps my confidence and provides me with a productive period where the wheels are turning and it usually shifts my block. It's sort of like a holiday for me, and the side project is something i can put on hold, guilt free, when i get jazzed about my main work.
Maybe write an 8bit style game or something?
Maybe about a pizza chef seeking 52 cheeses ;)
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That's something to consider, though in my current straits it'd have to be something that doesn't require technical heft while hitting some interest...
On the other hand, perhaps it is about time to finally start to type up (rough) design documents for the various game entities that have been residing solely in my head for this past good while? Would be bad if I lost the thread entirely on an idea rattling in my head from the stress and distractions and whatnot.
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Indeed, but i dare say you wouldn't entirely lose the thread. Just throw something together out of old routines from your library. Then again, the nature of coding is to find two problems for every one you solve. :-\
I intend to write a 8bit-grade 4X game. Its the environment generating routines that scare me, but for a good 4X they're essential. The environment also has to feel natural.
I haven't coded since i was a nipper, but the experience of pseudo-coding hasn't left me.
Hehehe, i used to code in BASIC on 8bit, then AMOS on the Amiga...i have a whole new syntax to learn and routine library to build. One advantage of modern machines is that my code won't have to (in theory at least) be too efficient.
Thinking about it, i have a LANGUAGE to choose to learn.
Give me 8 months and i'll be 'AAAAARRRGGH!!!' :o
Well, i hope your current block doesn't persist, it IS a grand thing you've gone for after all. :)
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Thanks for the words Cap n :)
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http://flame.escapemotions.com/ Went ahead and settled on this art program to be my first purchase/the one I try to do everything relative to it in today---I like the style, potential for other Element-oriented software to come, and it not being bloated and trying to do tons of stuff at once. The cheap price for the next couple days also handy as funds are scarce outside of the small bit I need to leave alone until actual business times come.
Still shaking things around code/sound wise, one in particular code wise, while in rotten Holiday straits. Still, gotta claw forward in what avenues I can...
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Well, things have been pretty bad on all fronts while trending towards much worse lately in general. :'(
BUT, as it so very randomly happened, and out of order at that, I'm now technically at another go of it getting onto a game development engine/IDE/programming wrangling thereof. 8)
It seems to be, to me, that the less one knows the more one has to gain via extreme harassment of people that know much---so that's pretty much the plan from here while saving some money in exchange for some Risk and Sweat.
I'm still intent on the other things in my somewhat secret "Plan A-various letters" rubric in terms of a game dev environ, so somehow some juggling and cross-doings will likely happen, but for now this'll be an object of my attentions.
http://pyrogine.com/index.php
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The above has now morphed into something a bit different(Engine-Library'ish thing), http://2drealms.com/index.php but now another of the "Plan A-various letters" projects has made it to the next major milestone, and as such it seems a prime time to jump in as well:
http://www.zgameeditor.org/index.php
Create games that have a redistributable size of only 64kb or less using procedural content. The game engine use OpenGL for graphics and a real time synthesizer for audio. ZGE is Free Open Source Software.
In other words, procedural sorcery---probably a good thing to come to grips with going forward and especially where Roguelike machinations are concerned.
Though I am horribly wracked with the other things afoot, I can still feel a spark from the likes of this that spurs me onward with some zeal and optimism. :)
ALSO: Slowly chipping away at the book on at what I hope to be an educational and useful ally named GS9 http://www.simion.co.uk/gs9/
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Well, the bottom of the OP now has one more addition that I am sad to say didn't get anywhere NEAR the amount of time and effort I've extended to nigh all prior Roguelikes and such I've helped out with----my boat on the seas of life continues to rock rather violently though I hope things are settling down somewhat. I really feel I owe them a much better effort, no matter how I have to wrangle it, should they let me take a crack at helping out again in what I hope to be their next title of many.
Overall progress has been terrible, but I've got something of a slim chance at getting on with an engine-oriented bit of employment in the near future---with a round of testing approaching that should make for a rather different sort of experience compared to Alpha and Beta testing of games.
Lots of exciting new Roguelikes kicking around in these past few months---so many and so little time!
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Getter, you have found a never ending quest, where the journey is the reward and every accomplishment along the way is priceless.
How could anything be more appropriate for a forum for Roguelikes.
I follow your journey with relish :)
Thanks for your inspriration,
Crunch
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A certain opportunity came my way recently on the commercial RPG dev front, but after trying to come to terms with it, I see that I was a mismatch for it in terms of skill level as well as just where I am at on the lot of things in terms of what it needed to be successful and quality. Going to do some thinking, going about things differently from here on, as it all served as something of a wake-up call.
I need to bolster what atypical strengths I have on top of somehow leveraging those in such a way as to begin to shore up my myriad weaknesses. Given these various tangential sorts of things have yet to get me over the hump and some momentum going, I should think it time to return to my Project Roguelike Renaissance routes and explore avenues not yet traveled for spark and inspiration.
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I recently learned that when it comes to furthering roguelike cause actual programming skill does not matter as much as enthusiasm and perseverance. Psiweapon picked up Zap'M and started improving it picking C++ skill along the way. Thanks to his example I grabbed source code and continued where he had temporarily left it. The accumulated changes are worth a release already.
So go for those atypical strengths.
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Thanks for the encouraging anecdote---will do! I think I already have one target in mind whom shall get a PM from me on here somewhere in the near future about trying to get some things better understood and situated...
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2011 = Not a great year for Project Roguelike Renaissance.....myriad disruptions had nowhere near as much progress on any front happen as would be preferred.
2012 = Going to be a much better year for Project Roguelike Renaissance else I am liable to snap.
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Well, it took entirely too damn long, but I think I can file my first "Indirect" bit of project help as sent off and done for now for 2012! :)
Now, to get caught up once again on everything else I've fallen behind on and see about a first "Direct" bit of project help for 2012...
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In a surprise to me today, I've now gotten involved in some Closed Alpha Testing for a "close enough" project---looking forward to getting something directly afoot early here in 2012 even if it wasn't the other direct thing I'd been intending on doing, which I still intend to, only now there's this to handle accordingly while still trying to catch up on all else and get better organized.
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getter77, how is the roguelike renaissance progressing, very well I hope? Anything interesting going on that you could share with the board?
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The opposite unfortunately....between health woes coming back to haunt me(but currently medicated towards the problem being not a problem, just going to take time) and especially an ever worsening family situation, my creative spark has slipped through my fingers and been eluding my grasp for awhile now. The prior alluded Closed Alpha didn't work out well as I sort of burned out in such a way that I just couldn't think of any feedback, nor enjoy myself no matter how I approached it, and that's no useful state to be in so I had to bow out into the night.
Yet, the compulsion is strong even if the means don't avail me at present and whatnot...I've still kept pretty close tabs to the goings on in the RL world even with all this trouble as per my digging around for things in the Announcements board and whatnot. Currently, I'm particularly trying to deal with, and making progress on, the general backlog of things primarily generated from the familial troubles (Aunt suddenly got cancer, situation quickly became a giant mess, etc) with the hope being that I can find my way back on track with all that squared away as opposed to hanging over my head.
Unsure if I'll be able to "aid" in some direct aspect towards the Roguelike Incubator or any sort of more concrete accomplishment for ARRP 2012(Prior to things falling apart, a strong notion was to work on a particular NotEye tileset..).
In other words, I remain undaunted even if unable----and will remain the former while hacking away at the latter.
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Sorry to hear that. I wish all the best to you and your family. Hopefully you can return back to renaissance project after sorting out the real life issues.
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Been out of it here in 2013 extra on account of my aunt passing away that suffered from Alzheimer's back on New Years day and one of my oldest cats discovered dead in her sleep back on Jan 12 in the morning---2013 off to a rough start in other words even if I continue to stalk out information and inspiration on all the various things.
Sort of bouncing back from the animal loss, though only sort of as while I've lost several over the years---this one constituted several firsts of the sad kind.
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Shit Getter I feel you. I just lost a kitty.
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Thanks Jo---she lived a long and good life of about 16/17 years though as some asshole threw both her and her brother out when they were just barely weaned and nigh starved to death. Her bro is still hanging in there, but they were pretty close.
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Thanks Jo---she lived a long and good life of about 16/17 years though as some asshole threw both her and her brother out when they were just barely weaned and nigh starved to death. Her bro is still hanging in there, but they were pretty close.
I have a strong closeness to animals myself. I had a golden retriever (Ariel) who was a wonderful dog, loyal and protective. Lost her at age 13 when I was 14. I felt horrible for my mother who had to hold her while she slowly passed. Thats the kind of shit that will stay with you for the rest of your life.
Luckily all of my dogs were treated well but thats not what I could say for one of my friends. I had a close friend who had a german shepherd, his father beat the thing, and after a while, the dog became used to violence. Now if you, me my friend or anyone in his family other than his father (master) goes near the dog, it will kill you without a moments notice. I told him that that dog will one day do something really bad and they should consider putting it down.
In better news, I hope your cat is at peace. You belong in this industry getter and you've recommended games on almost all sites I go on and for that you are a true gent!
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Thanks deathknight---I too had a much beloved dog once that also met a gruesome end...one of those situations where I was just old enough to fully understand how rage inducing and wrong it was, but not old enough to fly into an appropriate fury directly at the adult person responsible. That too will stay with me for life, though as a stark reminder of the sort of person to not become and to always value what imperceptible time I have with all.
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Things continue in their rough and roughly apace way, though this recent little bolt from the blue stands to put at least a bit of wind in the sails even in largely from shock value. :)
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/56637190/dungeonmans-the-heroic-adventure-roguelike/posts/560268